HAHA the truth is right there yet we are all so ignorant. In the military the maps used are updated every so often to make up for polar DRIFT. What do i mean. When you look at the compass on the maps they show north south east and west... next to north is a dashed line called "true north" and over time that angle is increasing... if the earth tilts even slightly the equator doesnt move with it... different regions will have different weather... global warming my ass....
It's so sad that there are still people out there who believe in superstition and religion. Now that more and more people are communicating freely over the internet, more such crap can be debunked quicker... humanity can finally move forward. Hopefully.
Sun Sign Horoscopes are junk, but no one in this video even mentions Planetary Aspects or birthchart comparisons, this is the real proof of astrology! Neither of these things depend on the zodiac constellations at all! My book and documentary are coming out in the next 40 days, I am a trained research scientist with an engineering an computer background, it will be time for the debunkers to eat some words!
I'm not a believer in astrology but why does it bother those of us who think it should be banned? Its no different than religion. People use it as a guidance, comfort and re-assurance in life. Even if the astrological predictions are nonsense, why rob them of that? We may think we are wiser and believe in pure science but it doesnt mean we have the right to rob people of their faith. I suggest to let them be. They do us no harm. I'd hate to see friends and relatives' faiths shattered...for what?
@theycallmemrglass said "I suggest to let them be. They do us no harm. I'd hate to see friends and relatives' faiths shattered...for what?"
Religion, astrology, and other pseudoscience believers SHOULD be confronted if an appropriate opportunity arises because it truly is mass delusion, and belief in this rubbish is a huge stumbling block to the advancement of humanity. Our culture has sympathized with followers of this crap for far too long, to our own detriment and dumbing down.
Is it any more ridiculous than what religious people believe? One group believes in the stars for their future..It seems more " scientific " than an invisible, all powerful and all the related bullshit
10,000? Are you trying to make me laugh? How about simply going along with the protocols that the JREF has suggested. For thos who may think this guy has a shred of credibility, here you go. He is old, old news.
The way I see it, Astrology is a form of prejudice. People are assumed to have certain attributes based on a factor of where and when they were born. In a nutshell that's the definition of prejudice.
Essentially you are relying on the "No True Scotsman" idea. There have been a great number and variety of tests on Astrology over the years. They are not hard to find, unless you are leary that they failed every one. You could have summarized the 4 paragragphs with one sentence, "I am gonna believe no matter what!".
@milesalpha1 You hit the nail on the head! You can apply the scientific method to any and all supernatural claims, and they always fail, yet there is always going to that special group of idiots who will simply believe because they find comfort in it. Religion, astrology, Ghosts, demons, tooth fairy, unicorns, etc. There are always going to be ignorant people like MistiClectiCisM. Best thing we can do is let them all know we're laughing at them. Maybe they'll start keeping it in the closet.
4) And four, yes, the fact that we can recognize ourselves in Many general descriptions which are largely, universal and will always be "true at times". But this is no way of properly debunking Astrology, only proof of the fact that (very bad) horoscopes, just like the generalizations of Personality Tests can "sound familiar" to all of us. When you try out Real and Modern Psychological Astrology there is no question of how accurate, helpful and non-universal it´s descriptions really are.
3) Pretentious holders of skeptical righteousness, please grow up and realize that astrologers have spoken for A LONG TIME about there being 2 Zodiacs, one the Constellation system and the second which we mostly use is the Tropical Zodiac which very simply coincides with the quadrants of the four stations, the beggining of Spring in the Northern Hemisphere representing the 0 point of the first Sign, Aries. It is not honorable to "debunk" withouth knowing what something really is.
2) Twins: do any two people really Want to be exactly alike? Why not study the case Properly like one would expect from Real scientists. Find out if they were born with same or different Rising Sign (which can change sometimes within one minute) and then study if the undercurrent of each ones life has correlation with the astrological or not: remembering that the astrological mirror symbol of life processes can be Manifested in very different ways remaining coherent with One Archetypal form.
@MistiClectiCisM You are Wise Indeed!! I'm coming out with a book and documentary to bring some sanity to this debate, been working on it for years. It will be a serious challenge to these closeminded "pure science" types, especially since my background is also science!
There is SO MUCH ignorance about Astrology portrayed in this video... However I have to agree it is heavily, densely and disgustingly polluted by false bull shit in the shape of magazine and press horoscopes and the likes...... Most of these "geniuses" who certainly know Nothing about real Astrology and have done their homework damn badly base their "debunking" on 3 things: 1) Astrology as horoscope... Please folks do your homework and confuse not Astrology with pseudoastrology...
Astrology has been thoroughly debunked, why in the world should he be interested in your little challenge? Get a university or media outlet involved and prove it to them, then perhaps you will have something worthwhile to submit. I suggest you come with a lot more than your ad-hom attacks and blind justifications though.
@milesalpha1 There are ten thousand reasons why and all of them dollars. Randi agreed to take my challenge and then he lied to weasel out of it, you will ask him why if you are truly interested, if not then just keep posting your uninformed and grossly wrong opinions.
Sagan was a pot head, if he didn't know enough to not smoke pot why should anyone believe anything else he says. Randi's test is stupid because all it demonstrates is how easy it is to do a cold reading with using generalities that we can all relate to. He ran from my astrology challenge and I have a ten thousand dollar "Honesty Challenge" that he is still running from, call him and ask him why he runs.
@Godsmasher22 It doesn't negate anything he said, what negates what he said was that what he said was wrong. He smoked pot because he said it gave him "perspective", in his views on astrology it gave him an obvious cloudy perspective. He also said some laudatory foolish things about Randi too, things that Randi himself has proven to be delusional, perhaps pot clouded his mind, like that whiskey you drink will, if you drink to much of it. Best not to drink or smoke if you want a clear mind.
@Godsmasher22 Did you contact Randi? Of course not. Why? Because you fear him and that is cowardly. Astrology has been proven accurate way beyond mathematical probability, and that is why Randi lied and runs from the truth. Just as you do, don't bother me with your stupid uneducated opinions unless you first ask Randi why he runs from Bill Perron. Your weak attempt at debunking is lamentable, who cares if you drink or smoke, astrology is the subject, Sagan was a pot head and it clouded his mind.
@billperron2 Actually Bill, astrology hasn't "been proven accurate way beyond mathematical probability." I have put scare quotes around this phrase of yours because it is meaningless bullshit. Astrology proposes vague 'predicitions,' readers cannot reliably identify their own astrological readings (that is they do not meet any criteria of statistical significance ever. Twins demolish astrology at the outset, fraternal twins especially. Astrologers blow only the hottest of air.
@Godsmasher22 Read "Cosmos and Psyche" by Tarnas, 30 years of astrological research, not fearful cowardly "bullshit" opinions such as yours, read and learn. I told you not to contact me until you asked Randi why he runs from my honesty challenge, I predicted you wouldn't because you are afraid to question another pseudo skeptic. Also went to the blog you suggested, nothing but the old fools opinions based on newspaper columns, that is not research that is just crap. Read the book and learn.
@billperron2 Why is it that my friends who believe in astrology never seem to have anything good happen to them? You'd think with this extra insight that they would be doing so much better than me.
@billperron2 - cite one scientific study that confirms the veracity of all astrological claims. Astrologer buffs quote numerous books but never any proper scientific studies - there have been over 35 studies done on the subject and the results of every one came to the same conclusion - astrology is no more accurate than guesswork. Astrologers (who were involved in many of the studies) say none of this is true. If not when are they going to do a study and prove otherwise? Never - obviously.
@LiamXaoh WRONG !!! The Gauquelin research done with many thousands of horoscopes proved astrology accurate beyond mathematical probability. Google it on line. Also since you bring so called scientific studies up there was a scientific study made upon the Gauquelin research and using the exact same methods scientists proved Gauquelin correct but that didn't fit into their agenda so they committed fraud and falsified their findings, read about that also on line: STARBABY by Rawlins then apologize
@billperron2 - LOL. Gauquelin's work has been reviewed and the supposed "Mars effect" was not there. He was also accused of being selective in his choice of data and also made no adjustments for multiple comparisons which made the results no longer statistically significant. No subsequent studies have been able to achieve the same results which seriously questions the veracity of his study. Like all good astrologer buffs you quote what you want to be true. Science isn't like that.
@LiamXaoh LIAR!!! If you read STARBABY then you know everything you just posted is a lie, a cowardly lie. You pseudo skeptics are all alike, closed minds that refuse to accept any truths that are contrary to your myopic agendas. Disgusting creatures, no balls, teensy brains, and loud mouths.
@billperron2 -boo hoo hoo sorry to rain on your parade with facts. I'm not a pseudo sceptic by the way, I'm a real one which is why I don't buy any baloney about astrology.
"Astrology is absolutely true until you test it." Adam Peenum.
@LiamXaoh You rained lies and fear and you know it. A real skeptic such as myself investigates all venues with an open mind, calling yourself a "real skeptic" is just another lie, I suspect mostly because you are lazy, fearful, egotistical, and just another boring old guy who can't face the truth, with a narrow mind, and that is another reason women think you're a jerk. Sadly you are truly oblivious to how the world sees you, but it's your own fault you've been self righteous all your sick life.
@billperron2 - whereas you simply try to find fault with someone who stands up to your nonsense. Get a life and go bother someone who cares to listen to your drivel.
@LiamXaoh You intelligence challenged idiot, you contacted me, my forgetful friend if you call repeating the usual pseudo skeptic uninformed trash "standing up" then you have just admitted you are no skeptic, just a brain dead parrot of others uninformed bilge. You obviously have not read STARBABY or Cosmos and Psyche which is further proof of your ignorance, a real skeptic would have read them and then if they found errors would have presented them, you didn't so you branded yourself a fool.
@billperron2 Ah, good, someone else quotes a few scattered sources (a book) against rational thinking and logic. Special interest borderline lunatic books and documentaries are everywhere and so are people who think they've been enlightened by the contents when they've just been fed a whole bunch of dodgy facts to confirm an idea they're already committed to. The problem with astrology is the impossibility and inanity of the primary premise.
@random007nadir Really? And how many books on astrology have you actually read? How many horoscopes have you actually calculated before you came to your conclusions?
@MsHojat It never ceases to amaze me how many old dudes are out there with nothing better to do than spout uninformed nonsense about a subject they readily admit they have never studied and refuse to study, how scientific is that?
@billperron2 PARA rejected Gauquelins' results, the whole committee rejected them! When he tried to do a second experiment with Mars, CFEPP rejected his calculations since he was adding and deleting athletes with no valid justification. So yeah, you use the work of a man who cant even show simple validity of his work, and then get mad when you are laughed at! Its sad when people believe in magic these days!
@eleminatus Who is PARA? Who is CFEPP never heard of them, must be some pseudo scientific group similar to CSICOP. How long did you study astrology? Or are you one of those dodo's who don't bother to actually learn about what they comment on?
@billperron2 PARA is Belgian committee who reviewed his first work on Mars. CFEPP is a French committee for the study of paranormal phenomenon, who rejected his second work on Mars when he was cherry-picking athletes. It seems its you who hasnt studied a single thing about this man! Look it up if you dont believe me, its freely accessed. On the studies issue, no I havent studied it much. The thing is, you CAN NOT study it in scientific sense at all!
@eleminatus Then why did SCICOP find it necessary to commit fraud and falsify their test of Gauquelins testing method that actually verified the Gauquelin research. Read about the whole despicable affair on line, Google STARBABY by Rawlins, if you dare.
@billperron2 first of all, you could not have chosen a more obscure case! Lets assume CSICOP did commit fraud. How can you prove it? All you provide is a book by a former member! To even start analyzing this case you need at least a report by CSICOP on Gauquelins' Mars research. Then, you point out what was altered in that report or in the methodology of comprising this report. That would be a great start! Can you or Rawlins provide at least this documentation?
@billperron2 secondly, besides CSICOP, there are two more organizations that showed errors in Gauquelin's methodology. Later one being most severe; he openly added and removed test subjects as he pleased without any justification! Thirdly, why cant anyone else repeat his calculations. We have many talented statisticians nowadays yet nobody can replicate it. Besides that, nothing else even resembling evidence for astrology exists. NOTHING! Do you now realize why we are skeptical?
@eleminatus What points? You made opinions, they are not points, they are what you openly admit are just uneducated opinions, nothing more. I really have no desire to educate you or debate a closed minded person such as yourself. I have often had to endure the uneducated opinions of others such as yourself and it truly gets boring after a while. Millions around the world find value in astrology, believe or don't believe what you will, I wish you well, but please don't bother me any more.
@billperron2 oh wow! Look at that! So when you are actually pressed against the wall you run like a little girl? You should be ashamed! Instead of addressing the issues I raise, you cleverly try to portray me as incompetent and dismiss me as fool! You see, I have a history of debating religious people, so such petty tricks dont work on me! If you cant hold a conversation or debate, and argue as intended, dont engage in such debates then!
@eleminatus Little girl? O.K. punk you want to see what a little girl can do to your face? I will be glad to meet you and have you say that to me face to face and you will learn some manners. Are you man enough or are you just a big talking punk?
@billperron2 so now you switch to threats? You are pathetic! You proved to me that you cant hold an intellectual debate, that you dont understand the scientific inquiry, that you ignore the facts that dont support your own claims and now you prove that you are just another redneck! Only uneducated bring a fist fight into an intellectual conversation. No wonder you like astrology so much! When you get your information from stars and not science, thats what you get!
@eleminatus Kid don't you have a life? Quit badgering me, it was never an intellectual conversation, it was some punk ass kid bothering me because he has no respect for his own life. If really had a life you wouldn't waste one second of it on some guy who doesn't care who you are, what you think, or anything else about your life wasting opinions.
@billperron2 this is getting better and better. I can see you are new to internet discussions so you keep on making these fallacies one after another. First, you tried to end a conversation with an assumed victory. Now you try to diminish me by calling me kid and call an internet conversation a waste of life. Besides being wrong on multiple levels, you are also a hypocrite! Or did you forget that you yourself are "wasting life" by typing out these replies?
@billperron2 people learn so much while conversing, while changing ideas and arguments. Thats why such forums exist. Thats why people comment here. Thats why I approached you. I asked simple questions and requests while providing arguments of my own. You did everything but answers those question, requests or arguments. If you dont know how to debate, especially on the web, dont engage in such debates. For now, all you do is make yourself look stupid, sir!
@eleminatus You are absolutely correct in everything you say and believe, I am stupid, I know nothing, I am a loser. Now please leave me the fuck alone.
@billperron2 the fact that a single book is not evidence for anything is NOT an opinion; the fact that two other committees debunked statistical calculations of Gauquelin is NOT opinion; the fact that all kind of research is documented is NOT an opinion; the fact that astrology has no evidence is NOT an opinion! You dont care for THE TRUTH, you care for YOUR TRUTH! You ignore facts, dont address issues, dont have proof yet dare call others close-minded. You are a disgrace!
@eleminatus I don't give a crap about your opinions, I told you that before, but now you have pissed me off, if you are looking for trouble look no further, I'm right here.
@billperron2 you see, its ironic that you used the word pseudo-science, since astrology is one of them. Its simply not scientific. Can you provide any peer-reviewed papers on astrology? Can you provide approved research that follows the scientific method? Can you provide the social study where correlation between people and planets is present? NO! Such things dont exist! There is no valid study on the topic, there are no scientific proof, there are people like you who dont know better!
And once again I explain, most astrology does nothing but tell you, "today will be a good day if you are considerate to your coworkers" "if you take the time to sit and relax you will find a new perspective." So again i ask you, what is the problem with this? Who gives a rat's pah-tooty if others care not about the stars shifting or whether or not astrology gives you a generalization? Hopeful doesnt mean theyll throw their money in something hoping for a new life. Come on peeps, ffs.
Jeesh so many responses since I've been gone. Let me think for a second (sorry this process tends to take a bit.) Once again someone said the word hope, when I explained before that that i already said hopeful, there's a difference. These are smart people, of that I know is true. However I never said people should spend money on it, and you people being all uppidy won't change the minds of people who will, so me saying its not a bad thing hurts nothing.
@truthseeker010101 Their* graves? Fucking neanderthal. I'd piss on YOU'RE (notice I know how to imply possession properly) grave too. But unfortunately for me, you are a fucking nameless nobody.
And by the way neither of those two people live in ALABAMA. And I know for a fact you're hill billy ass can't navigate an airport, so I don't see how you could accomplish that.
@bushiyo2 Not that I'm trying to be a grammar nazi but YOU'RE = YOU ARE (Contraction) YOUR = BELONGING TO YOU (Possessive pronoun). Apostrophes used with pronouns ALWAYS indicate a contraction. Possessive pronouns NEVER have an apostrophe. As for my credentials...I have a Master's Degree in English and spent 10 years teaching Composition to college freshmen.
@GottaStopKillin - give up now. Most folks do'nt care about there inglish and grama when they post. Apostophe's are put where they seem too fit to. Spell'n has know meanin two.
TED.com has numerous great talks shining the light of truth on bilge like astrology.
Michael Shermer is one of the talk givers; The Amazing Randi also gives a good talk.
TED.COM
Bill Nye screwed up in his section. He should have flat out crushed astrology. As it is, he left the door open to the possibility that it still might be so...though there really ISN'T.
To believe in astrology, really believe, is to demonstrate a passion for ignorance. Why should we care? Because there are people who make money out of this. There's a part of me that takes its hat off to them, but a bigger part of me thinks we should get rid of the market through a little education.
and i never said it gave them hope, i said it makes them hopeful, there is a very distinctive difference in the two, and being hopeful can never hurt, no matter the reason.
Making someone "hopeful" can come at a cost. Generally when one is prone to superstition and does not allow themselves to use critical thinking they become susceptible to hucksters of all sorts. People can waste their time with "hopeful" distractions when they could be doing something genuinely useful with their time. They can also fritter away their money. I have known many people with barely two dimes to scratch together that have wasted $ on astro readings and similar nonsense.
so get over your petty disputes, just let some people believe in it, astrology can only serve to make people hopeful and interested in daily life, as well as give good advice to them. so why again are you so against it?
@KLowD9x how is it false hope? incase you havent noticed theres no actual fortunes, horror scopes dont tell you if you go left your entire life will change and your become a millionaire. they tell you things like, if you compromise more today you will find people receive you better. next time think about what your discussing before you stick your foot in your mouth.
@mattc851 It is false hope because they tell you nothing. Anyone can give you words of encouragement but there is no need to look to some pseudoscience horse shit for some inspiration.
Go talk to a friend if you need some advice, not a newspaper.
Astrology blows but not more then this movie. These are the most ill formed and the least convincing arguments I have ever heard. Why don't you guys gain some intelligence and spend less time trying frantically to refute things that don't matter.
Wow you people have way too much time on your hands people. Look the abstract ideals of Astrology and horoscopes and such is merely a different way of thinking. Scientist love to this with their time and grants, they spend all that money and energy disproving things and telling the public they think the wrong things and everyone goes crazy over it, for or against. No one seems to want to think that the scientist just wasted a lot of time and money on doing absolutely nothing useful.
And no matter what you say they really are wasting time and energy, I felt like throwing my computer after watching 9 minutes of these people babbling on about fact and fiction. I have no idea what kind of studies these people did, but I've done personality tests and psych evals in college and I fit no other sign than a Taurus, no matter what book I've read about astrology.
" I've done personality tests and psych evals in college and I fit no other sign than a Taurus, no matter what book I've read about astrology."
Well you have heard that the earth has shifted over the course of the past few thousand years right and that recently an "official" statement was made that everyone is actually one sign different than they originally thought right? So you are in fact no longer Taurus at all. Still think it's so accurate?
@mattc851 And you've done nothing useful other than make yourself look defensive. If you have a valid argument for why your belief is valid and provable, then say so.
@tjackso0 if you perceived me as defensive then you really need to double check, i was agreeing with neither side, nor do i feel i need to provide a "valid" argument for this. i care nothing that you people so avidly disbelieve something that effects your life so little. if you dont believe in it then thats fine, not like its existence or people believing in it is hurting you. how many people here were beaten half to death or abused because of astrology? i bet you the answer is none.
Carl Sagan, Richard Dawkins, Neil DeGrasse Tyson debunked astrology, and people still believe it? Three great scientists are wrong and people without first grade astronomy knowledge are right? People are pathetic
@JLuvs0fficial Where is the scientifc study have these three scientists have debunked astrology? Where can I check that astrology has been debunked and see there results.? Was this study done under neutral scientific method procedures and independently checked. If not, then this video is flawed and not worthy of anything! Do NOT agree with any science opinion unless it can be backed up with evidence, proof and data presented. The only pseudoscience is believing in this video.
@TheLogic1010 Wait, wait, wait.. Are you calling Carl Sagan a pseudo-scientist? Neil DeGrasse? Hahahahahaha.. Did you even watch the video? They debunked astrology in the video. Did you not see when Richard Dawkins gave people the WRONG zodiac signs? Did you not see Neil DeGrasse's 2/3 test? Can you answer Richard Dawkins question? How can the position of the stars effect our physiology? Do stars, or DNA decide our personalities?
@JLuvs0fficial Yes, I'm calling all three pseudo scientists. They haven't debunked astrology. A personal biased opinion is non science. I don't think you read my comment. Saga, Dawkins and Degrasse have not done what science is all about. So therefore its a pseudo video. Can you show me the reference to the scientific study that these three under took to debunk astrology?? Once you have answered my criticism of this video, I can answer your questions!
@TheLogic1010 You're an idiot calling Carl Sagan a pseudo-scientist. He's done more for the scientific community than you will ever do, or any astrologer. Also, you obviously don't know what science is about, it's about test and experimentation, which they did by giving people the wrong horoscopes. That was an experiment testing its accuracy, which failed. Did you not hear Carl Sagan say "the only effect Mars can have on us is its gravity."
@JLuvs0fficial I would be very careful to call anyone an idiot. With regards to Carl Sagan he is not out of limits to criticism. I will ask you, do you know what science is?? When did astrology ever say that gravity was involved?? You have a lot to think about mr scientist?
@TheLogic1010 For someone whose moniker is "TheLogic" you sure don't use any. You're an idiot, with no merit to call Sagan a pseudoscientist. Albert Einstein said astrology was "pseudo-science" and "superstitious", is he a pseudoscientist as well? Just because people oppose your view doesn't make them a pseudoscientist. There have been tons of large-scale studies attempting to prove the accuracy of astrology, all which have failed
(cont) as for your questions. Yes, I know what science is, I am a scientist (neuroscientist). You obviously don't know what science is, because astrology is a pseudoscience. As for my comment regarding gravity, planets do NOT emit energy, so the only way Mars can effect us is by its gravity. You never answered my question. Do stars, or DNA decide our personality? How can planetary positioning effect our physiology.
@JLuvs0fficial I would think it is quite embarassing for yourself to admit to being a scientist? Astrology is no pseudoscience, your ignorance isn't. Jupiter emits energy, radiowaves infact. Not really good at this science stuff, are we? The professors at Oxford university are now answering how the planets affect physiology. To answer your question about DNA and astrology would obviously be too deep for you to understand. Gravity is not involved in astrology. So have another go mr scientist?
@TheLogic1010 I never said gravity is involved in astrology, you imbecile. Learn how to fucking read. I find it quite embarrassing you think you are smart, haha. Where are the papers from Oxford stating planets can affect our physiology? I tried to search for them, but couldn't find them anywhere.. Lastly, I may not be a physicist, but I am knowledgeable in regards to DNA. I know the only factors involved in personality is DNA, and epigenetics. Or can you prove me wrong?
@JLuvs0fficial So what did you mean about gravity? Swearing won't make you sound any cleverer! Others who have looked for the reference about the 2 oxford professors have found the source, we're not very bright are we? We know your no physicist! Astrology has proved you wrong, but you don't get!!
@JLuvs Listen, I know your not very bright but I will endulge your stupidity. My comment was someone who call's themselves a scientist but doesn't look scientifically at astrology and holds bias, personal views is a pseudoscientist. DO YOU UNDERSTAND? Direct me to the source of your comments of Einstein's views about astrology? Listen again, my argument is not about anyone disageeing with my view. It's the lack of scientific objectivity. No neutral, unbiased study has ever disproved astrology.
@TheLogic1010 Like I said, YOU'RE an idiot. (I find it funny you say I'm not bright when you're using incorrect homonyms). In order for a field to be considered scientific, it has to be parsimonious, empirically testable and falsifiable, progressive, correctable and dynamic, consistent and tentative. Astrology doesn't fit ANY prerequisites, thus making astrology pseudoscience. Having a personal bias DOES NOT make one a pseudoscientist
@JLuvs0fficial I think you need to look closer home. Who ever said that astrology wanted to be considered scientific? You can includ yourself as a psuedoscientist. Having personal biases is unscientific. Again, you don't get it. Am I writing to a child?
@TheLogic1010 January 7, 1943 Mr. Eugene Simon c.o. Rabbi Herman Simon 184 East Willmore Ave. St.Paul, Minn. Dear Sir: I fully agree with you concerning the pseudo-science of astrology. The interesting point is that this kind of superstition is so tenacious that it could persist through so many centuries. Very truly yours, (Signed, 'A. Einstein') Professor Albert Einstein
@JLuvs0fficial Yes, I have seen this letter published and therefore it could be true? What I have in answer, if Albert Einstein wrote these words and believed astrology to be a pseudoscience, does that mean that he was also correct with his views on quantum theory?
Nothing can prove Santa Clause wrong neither, I guess you believe in Santa Clause as well huh? Astrology is nothing but pseudoscience and is easily debunked
HAHA!! This is what happens when repairmen start flying the plane.... IT CRASHES!!
#1- Astrology and Horoscopes are NOT the same.
#2- Twins born minutes apart - the aspects and angles of the planets relative to one another are PERPETUALLY in flux, expressed as degrees and minutes. Thus, there are an incredibly large number of potential combinations of aspects the planets and other astral bodies can form as a complete snapshot at any moment in time.
If that is so then what is it about the planets alignment that has the effect on us? As Sagan states, the gravitational pull of Mars is less substantial than the gravitational pull of everyday objects within our immediate vicinity, so it's clearly not gravity.
@vadimcream Yes, Absolutely right question.... there's sometimes a hype about the gravitational pull of the planets and now there is another theory about the electro magnetic field of the planets but hear now the truth about astrology...
Astrology is simply the science (STUDY) of behavorial patterns in humans in accordance with the Cosmic movement... THAT'S IT!!! Who know what is it about the damn planets that does affect us... Everything affects everything... CONTINUED
@vegeteriancannibal The idea that the planetary movements don't affect us is non feasable in accordance with modern science itself because, modern psycology suggests that there are circumstances, visual and audio that though not focused on by the subject particulary, leaves and imprint on the subconcious mind and therefore influences his decisions and behaviour... Haven't you watched Derren Brown? CONTINUED
@vegeteriancannibal Astrology tried to study weather or not cosmic movements also influence human behaviour and found many behaviourial patterns that were directy in link with the cosmic movements, that's it. Everything in the Universe affects everything, Astrology is a study to find if there is a system to it and the findings have been astounding however, because of the infamy that Blind Believers of Randomness have deterred on Astrology, people have no idea what astrology really is!!
All of the claims you've made are completely unsubstantiated. They have not been verified by any stretch of the imagination and merely typing them out with exclamation points doesn't make them at all true.
And BTW look up the word "deter", it doesn't mean what you think it does.
@vadimcream Funny, I thought deter meant oppose and funnier because I research on astrology and so far I have learnt which you can verify with any astrology institution in the world that astrology was and always will be comparing cosmic movements with human behaviour and finding a pattern.... what is so difficult to understand here... astrology may have many forms but as far as I know, Vedic Astrology is just this. CONTINUED
@vegeteriancannibal Does the movement of celestial bodies in the cosmos affect Human behaviour? Well that's still the study, why does it affect Human behaviour, many theories but still Unknown. Sorry, I only keep saying Human behaviour but it's also, planetary positions exerting positive and negative energies (so to speak) to create favourable and unfavourable times for select actions.
Ok, well considering English isn't your first language I'll cut you some slack and compliment you on how well you do express yourself... But other than that I'm surprised you brought up Derren Brown before as he is a renowned sceptic and does not believe astrology one bit... Next, nothing is "difficult to understand", it's just that, like I said, you throw out all of these dubious claims as if they are a matter of proven fact and they are anything but... CONTINUED.
Celestial bodies effecting us? Planetary positions "exerting pos and neg energies"? These things sound nice but they are not rooted in any fact of any kind. Yes there are many who make the same claims as you, but random claims aren't facts.
And FYI, I have read up extensively on astrology. I grew up in a household that was very open to these sorts of things. I used to believe, but once I applied logic to it and read up on the available facts, I let go of that superstitious belief.
@vadimcream Then it's a shame you couldn't grasp the essence of astrology even with all that resources and still don't get it!! Put more logic into it and think of what i am saying.... there are various types of astrology now, how many of them do you really know about?? Vedic astrology began as a simple observation of planetary movements with different earthly behaviours, just like how we see a pattern of how many people tend to sleep during the night and work during the day, it's just that...
@vegeteriancannibal what facts are we at all talking about? There were thoussands if not 100s of thousand observations made and many of them show a distinct pattern which is why it still exists today...... of course, i give up if it is the usual quack astrologers in abundance everywhere now is what you are talking about but in India, there is a foundation that has been preserving the knowledge for 100s of years... wait a bit, i'll post some sources for you to go through.
The other two websites look really cheesy but just try and understand the concept of vedic astrology from these sources. And like i said, i don't know what it is about the celestial bodies in the cosmos that influences the earthly behaviours but the study still is about weather or not it actually does affect earthly behaviours... Certain patterns found keeps it alive
These things do not add up to a "distinct pattern". That's just the problem with things like astrology, when submitted to double blind testing it's never been shown to display considerable predictive power. The patterns that you and others think are there are self imposed, which is why a room filled with people of all different signs can be given the same exact reading and all of them can feel as if their reading is spot on.
@vadimcream 1st, it's called barnum statements that are statements that anyone can relate to, 2nd... looking at different birth charts and telling a doctor that he/she is in the medical field withouht knowing that he/she was a doctor and telling an engineer he is into construction withouht knowing he is an engineer is NOT Barnum Statements, Clearly you have absolutely no idea about astrology apart from western astrology (No Offence) Continued...
As for the birth charts thing. Please show me legitimate documentation of it consistantly having the predictive power to correctly guess people's occupation. I can believe that those instances would be true if they are cherry picked from hundreds of readings and happen to be the ones that were true through coincidence; but until you show me real evidence I'm going to assume this is just an empty claim you are making.
@vadimcream Hmm... very good point.... DOCUMENTATION you say, are you bloody nuts!!! Astrology till date is not considered a science, it's considered a psuedo-science so how can i show you any documentations? I'll tell you why though astrology is considered a psuedo science, it is because there are so many damn variations of it! Proof of consistant predictive power in VEDIC Astrology though, i must say, i don't bloody have any do you know why, BECAUSE IT HAS NOT BEEN DOCUMENTED YET!!! Continued.
@vegeteriancannibal the only proof i can give you is that there is but a study of the vedic astrology whereby you can learn what position of which planet on which houses mean what therefore, go document it yourself and then YOU prove it that it's all bullshit!!
"DOCUMENTATION you say, are you bloody nuts!!! ".
Look man, you were the one who made the claim about Vedic astrology predicting people's unique careers. If you don't want to provide proof of these statements then don't make them in the first place and don't get in a huff when you are expected to back them up.
I was asking this to determine how you thought celestial bodies have an effect on us. It's been proven that the gravitational pull of far away objects have less effect on us than objects within our immediate vicinity (sagan explains this in the video we are commenting on). So how does it effect us so profoundly? And what of the shifting of the earth in the last 2000 years making us all off one full sign?
@vadimcream 1st, i didn't say you believe in supernatual things, you asked me if astrology is based on supernatural principles and i said that if YOU believe that astrology is based on supernatural beliefs then our discussion is over.... 2nd, have you at all not been reading what i have been writing, i keep telling you that we don't know what energies or forces of the celestial bodies astrology believs influences earthly behaviours but it sees a pattern in the coinciding movements between us..
HAHA the truth is right there yet we are all so ignorant. In the military the maps used are updated every so often to make up for polar DRIFT. What do i mean. When you look at the compass on the maps they show north south east and west... next to north is a dashed line called "true north" and over time that angle is increasing... if the earth tilts even slightly the equator doesnt move with it... different regions will have different weather... global warming my ass....
gilligan80 2 weeks ago
It's so sad that there are still people out there who believe in superstition and religion. Now that more and more people are communicating freely over the internet, more such crap can be debunked quicker... humanity can finally move forward. Hopefully.
0debug 2 months ago 2
Sun Sign Horoscopes are junk, but no one in this video even mentions Planetary Aspects or birthchart comparisons, this is the real proof of astrology! Neither of these things depend on the zodiac constellations at all! My book and documentary are coming out in the next 40 days, I am a trained research scientist with an engineering an computer background, it will be time for the debunkers to eat some words!
ForThePeopleShow 2 months ago
@thatamazinggeek You have no idea how many people actually believe in this nonsense especially
women. Many world leaders have consulted with astrologers among them several American presidents
like Reagan, there is also Winston Churchill and Adolf Hitler.
MultiKronblom 3 months ago
@thatamazinggeek Have you ever met people before?
VoidOnTuesday 4 months ago in playlist Informative
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No wonder the USA is going down the toilet. For creationism to be true all science has to be meaningless.
ZoeMarks 4 months ago
I'm not a believer in astrology but why does it bother those of us who think it should be banned? Its no different than religion. People use it as a guidance, comfort and re-assurance in life. Even if the astrological predictions are nonsense, why rob them of that? We may think we are wiser and believe in pure science but it doesnt mean we have the right to rob people of their faith. I suggest to let them be. They do us no harm. I'd hate to see friends and relatives' faiths shattered...for what?
theycallmemrglass 4 months ago
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@theycallmemrglass
Who said it should be banned?
Kinin4 3 months ago
@theycallmemrglass said "I suggest to let them be. They do us no harm. I'd hate to see friends and relatives' faiths shattered...for what?"
Religion, astrology, and other pseudoscience believers SHOULD be confronted if an appropriate opportunity arises because it truly is mass delusion, and belief in this rubbish is a huge stumbling block to the advancement of humanity. Our culture has sympathized with followers of this crap for far too long, to our own detriment and dumbing down.
Discern4 1 month ago
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Is it any more ridiculous than what religious people believe? One group believes in the stars for their future..It seems more " scientific " than an invisible, all powerful and all the related bullshit
test123ok 4 months ago
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test123ok 4 months ago
It should be Mike Tyson.
EldestSauce 4 months ago
The narrator's voice sounds suspiciously like the voice on those Geico commercials...
warrenfields1 4 months ago
10,000? Are you trying to make me laugh? How about simply going along with the protocols that the JREF has suggested. For thos who may think this guy has a shred of credibility, here you go. He is old, old news.
xxx.randi.org/jr/2006-06/060906just.html#i2
milesalpha1 5 months ago
"Religions require blind faith and ignorance of science - whereas astrology is the other way around." Adam Peenum.
LiamXaoh 5 months ago
sagan's last and second last points are so great :)
ilytopy 5 months ago
The way I see it, Astrology is a form of prejudice. People are assumed to have certain attributes based on a factor of where and when they were born. In a nutshell that's the definition of prejudice.
dedokta 5 months ago
I heard there was a defense for the tilt of the planet... something about the equator blah blah blah...
chrisdryer 6 months ago
so much hate on skeptics... yet they're here, commenting and giving the Truth views. @sanosukeafo "unicorns" hahaha good one.
seekandestroy77 6 months ago
@thatamazinggeek Yes, because some people are stupid.
KaptenN 6 months ago
Essentially you are relying on the "No True Scotsman" idea. There have been a great number and variety of tests on Astrology over the years. They are not hard to find, unless you are leary that they failed every one. You could have summarized the 4 paragragphs with one sentence, "I am gonna believe no matter what!".
milesalpha1 6 months ago
@milesalpha1 You hit the nail on the head! You can apply the scientific method to any and all supernatural claims, and they always fail, yet there is always going to that special group of idiots who will simply believe because they find comfort in it. Religion, astrology, Ghosts, demons, tooth fairy, unicorns, etc. There are always going to be ignorant people like MistiClectiCisM. Best thing we can do is let them all know we're laughing at them. Maybe they'll start keeping it in the closet.
Sanosukeafo 6 months ago
4) And four, yes, the fact that we can recognize ourselves in Many general descriptions which are largely, universal and will always be "true at times". But this is no way of properly debunking Astrology, only proof of the fact that (very bad) horoscopes, just like the generalizations of Personality Tests can "sound familiar" to all of us. When you try out Real and Modern Psychological Astrology there is no question of how accurate, helpful and non-universal it´s descriptions really are.
MistiClectiCisM 6 months ago
3) Pretentious holders of skeptical righteousness, please grow up and realize that astrologers have spoken for A LONG TIME about there being 2 Zodiacs, one the Constellation system and the second which we mostly use is the Tropical Zodiac which very simply coincides with the quadrants of the four stations, the beggining of Spring in the Northern Hemisphere representing the 0 point of the first Sign, Aries. It is not honorable to "debunk" withouth knowing what something really is.
MistiClectiCisM 6 months ago
2) Twins: do any two people really Want to be exactly alike? Why not study the case Properly like one would expect from Real scientists. Find out if they were born with same or different Rising Sign (which can change sometimes within one minute) and then study if the undercurrent of each ones life has correlation with the astrological or not: remembering that the astrological mirror symbol of life processes can be Manifested in very different ways remaining coherent with One Archetypal form.
MistiClectiCisM 6 months ago
@MistiClectiCisM You are Wise Indeed!! I'm coming out with a book and documentary to bring some sanity to this debate, been working on it for years. It will be a serious challenge to these closeminded "pure science" types, especially since my background is also science!
ForThePeopleShow 2 months ago
There is SO MUCH ignorance about Astrology portrayed in this video... However I have to agree it is heavily, densely and disgustingly polluted by false bull shit in the shape of magazine and press horoscopes and the likes...... Most of these "geniuses" who certainly know Nothing about real Astrology and have done their homework damn badly base their "debunking" on 3 things: 1) Astrology as horoscope... Please folks do your homework and confuse not Astrology with pseudoastrology...
MistiClectiCisM 6 months ago
@MistiClectiCisM Astrology is just a load of carp.
cornflakeclusters 5 months ago
Astrology has been thoroughly debunked, why in the world should he be interested in your little challenge? Get a university or media outlet involved and prove it to them, then perhaps you will have something worthwhile to submit. I suggest you come with a lot more than your ad-hom attacks and blind justifications though.
milesalpha1 6 months ago
@milesalpha1 There are ten thousand reasons why and all of them dollars. Randi agreed to take my challenge and then he lied to weasel out of it, you will ask him why if you are truly interested, if not then just keep posting your uninformed and grossly wrong opinions.
billperron2 5 months ago
Sagan was a pot head, if he didn't know enough to not smoke pot why should anyone believe anything else he says. Randi's test is stupid because all it demonstrates is how easy it is to do a cold reading with using generalities that we can all relate to. He ran from my astrology challenge and I have a ten thousand dollar "Honesty Challenge" that he is still running from, call him and ask him why he runs.
skepticslayer1234 6 months ago
@skepticslayer1234 Sagan smoked pot. That hardly negates the things he said. I drink beer, and the occasional whiskey.
Godsmasher22 6 months ago
@Godsmasher22 It doesn't negate anything he said, what negates what he said was that what he said was wrong. He smoked pot because he said it gave him "perspective", in his views on astrology it gave him an obvious cloudy perspective. He also said some laudatory foolish things about Randi too, things that Randi himself has proven to be delusional, perhaps pot clouded his mind, like that whiskey you drink will, if you drink to much of it. Best not to drink or smoke if you want a clear mind.
skepticslayer1234 6 months ago
@skepticslayer1234 I don't drink or smoke and I realise that astrology is total, utter bullshit.
cornflakeclusters 5 months ago
@Godsmasher22 Did you contact Randi? Of course not. Why? Because you fear him and that is cowardly. Astrology has been proven accurate way beyond mathematical probability, and that is why Randi lied and runs from the truth. Just as you do, don't bother me with your stupid uneducated opinions unless you first ask Randi why he runs from Bill Perron. Your weak attempt at debunking is lamentable, who cares if you drink or smoke, astrology is the subject, Sagan was a pot head and it clouded his mind.
billperron2 5 months ago
@billperron2 Actually Bill, astrology hasn't "been proven accurate way beyond mathematical probability." I have put scare quotes around this phrase of yours because it is meaningless bullshit. Astrology proposes vague 'predicitions,' readers cannot reliably identify their own astrological readings (that is they do not meet any criteria of statistical significance ever. Twins demolish astrology at the outset, fraternal twins especially. Astrologers blow only the hottest of air.
Godsmasher22 5 months ago
@Godsmasher22 Read "Cosmos and Psyche" by Tarnas, 30 years of astrological research, not fearful cowardly "bullshit" opinions such as yours, read and learn. I told you not to contact me until you asked Randi why he runs from my honesty challenge, I predicted you wouldn't because you are afraid to question another pseudo skeptic. Also went to the blog you suggested, nothing but the old fools opinions based on newspaper columns, that is not research that is just crap. Read the book and learn.
billperron2 5 months ago
@billperron2 Why is it that my friends who believe in astrology never seem to have anything good happen to them? You'd think with this extra insight that they would be doing so much better than me.
dedokta 5 months ago
@dedokta Since I don't know you or your friends I can not offer a knowledgeable opinion.
billperron2 5 months ago
@billperron2 - cite one scientific study that confirms the veracity of all astrological claims. Astrologer buffs quote numerous books but never any proper scientific studies - there have been over 35 studies done on the subject and the results of every one came to the same conclusion - astrology is no more accurate than guesswork. Astrologers (who were involved in many of the studies) say none of this is true. If not when are they going to do a study and prove otherwise? Never - obviously.
LiamXaoh 5 months ago
@LiamXaoh WRONG !!! The Gauquelin research done with many thousands of horoscopes proved astrology accurate beyond mathematical probability. Google it on line. Also since you bring so called scientific studies up there was a scientific study made upon the Gauquelin research and using the exact same methods scientists proved Gauquelin correct but that didn't fit into their agenda so they committed fraud and falsified their findings, read about that also on line: STARBABY by Rawlins then apologize
billperron2 5 months ago
@billperron2 - LOL. Gauquelin's work has been reviewed and the supposed "Mars effect" was not there. He was also accused of being selective in his choice of data and also made no adjustments for multiple comparisons which made the results no longer statistically significant. No subsequent studies have been able to achieve the same results which seriously questions the veracity of his study. Like all good astrologer buffs you quote what you want to be true. Science isn't like that.
LiamXaoh 5 months ago
@LiamXaoh LIAR!!! If you read STARBABY then you know everything you just posted is a lie, a cowardly lie. You pseudo skeptics are all alike, closed minds that refuse to accept any truths that are contrary to your myopic agendas. Disgusting creatures, no balls, teensy brains, and loud mouths.
billperron2 5 months ago
@billperron2 -boo hoo hoo sorry to rain on your parade with facts. I'm not a pseudo sceptic by the way, I'm a real one which is why I don't buy any baloney about astrology.
"Astrology is absolutely true until you test it." Adam Peenum.
LiamXaoh 5 months ago
@LiamXaoh You rained lies and fear and you know it. A real skeptic such as myself investigates all venues with an open mind, calling yourself a "real skeptic" is just another lie, I suspect mostly because you are lazy, fearful, egotistical, and just another boring old guy who can't face the truth, with a narrow mind, and that is another reason women think you're a jerk. Sadly you are truly oblivious to how the world sees you, but it's your own fault you've been self righteous all your sick life.
billperron2 5 months ago
@billperron2 - whereas you simply try to find fault with someone who stands up to your nonsense. Get a life and go bother someone who cares to listen to your drivel.
LiamXaoh 5 months ago
@LiamXaoh You intelligence challenged idiot, you contacted me, my forgetful friend if you call repeating the usual pseudo skeptic uninformed trash "standing up" then you have just admitted you are no skeptic, just a brain dead parrot of others uninformed bilge. You obviously have not read STARBABY or Cosmos and Psyche which is further proof of your ignorance, a real skeptic would have read them and then if they found errors would have presented them, you didn't so you branded yourself a fool.
billperron2 5 months ago
@billperron2 -still not caring...
LiamXaoh 5 months ago
@billperron2 Ah, good, someone else quotes a few scattered sources (a book) against rational thinking and logic. Special interest borderline lunatic books and documentaries are everywhere and so are people who think they've been enlightened by the contents when they've just been fed a whole bunch of dodgy facts to confirm an idea they're already committed to. The problem with astrology is the impossibility and inanity of the primary premise.
random007nadir 5 months ago
@random007nadir Really? And how many books on astrology have you actually read? How many horoscopes have you actually calculated before you came to your conclusions?
billperron2 5 months ago
@billperron2 you are deluded. Take a good objective look at yourself (your beliefs). Before you say the same to me let me tell you I already have.
MsHojat 5 months ago
@MsHojat It never ceases to amaze me how many old dudes are out there with nothing better to do than spout uninformed nonsense about a subject they readily admit they have never studied and refuse to study, how scientific is that?
billperron2 5 months ago
@billperron2 PARA rejected Gauquelins' results, the whole committee rejected them! When he tried to do a second experiment with Mars, CFEPP rejected his calculations since he was adding and deleting athletes with no valid justification. So yeah, you use the work of a man who cant even show simple validity of his work, and then get mad when you are laughed at! Its sad when people believe in magic these days!
eleminatus 4 months ago
@eleminatus Who is PARA? Who is CFEPP never heard of them, must be some pseudo scientific group similar to CSICOP. How long did you study astrology? Or are you one of those dodo's who don't bother to actually learn about what they comment on?
billperron2 4 months ago
@billperron2 PARA is Belgian committee who reviewed his first work on Mars. CFEPP is a French committee for the study of paranormal phenomenon, who rejected his second work on Mars when he was cherry-picking athletes. It seems its you who hasnt studied a single thing about this man! Look it up if you dont believe me, its freely accessed. On the studies issue, no I havent studied it much. The thing is, you CAN NOT study it in scientific sense at all!
eleminatus 4 months ago
@eleminatus Then why did SCICOP find it necessary to commit fraud and falsify their test of Gauquelins testing method that actually verified the Gauquelin research. Read about the whole despicable affair on line, Google STARBABY by Rawlins, if you dare.
billperron2 4 months ago
@billperron2 first of all, you could not have chosen a more obscure case! Lets assume CSICOP did commit fraud. How can you prove it? All you provide is a book by a former member! To even start analyzing this case you need at least a report by CSICOP on Gauquelins' Mars research. Then, you point out what was altered in that report or in the methodology of comprising this report. That would be a great start! Can you or Rawlins provide at least this documentation?
eleminatus 4 months ago
@billperron2 secondly, besides CSICOP, there are two more organizations that showed errors in Gauquelin's methodology. Later one being most severe; he openly added and removed test subjects as he pleased without any justification! Thirdly, why cant anyone else repeat his calculations. We have many talented statisticians nowadays yet nobody can replicate it. Besides that, nothing else even resembling evidence for astrology exists. NOTHING! Do you now realize why we are skeptical?
eleminatus 4 months ago
@eleminatus If you actually knew what you are talking about you would know Rawlins is a scientific astronomer and a founding member of CSICOP.
billperron2 4 months ago
@billperron2 I know who he is and what he did. You havent addressed my points!
eleminatus 4 months ago
@eleminatus What points? You made opinions, they are not points, they are what you openly admit are just uneducated opinions, nothing more. I really have no desire to educate you or debate a closed minded person such as yourself. I have often had to endure the uneducated opinions of others such as yourself and it truly gets boring after a while. Millions around the world find value in astrology, believe or don't believe what you will, I wish you well, but please don't bother me any more.
billperron2 4 months ago
@billperron2 oh wow! Look at that! So when you are actually pressed against the wall you run like a little girl? You should be ashamed! Instead of addressing the issues I raise, you cleverly try to portray me as incompetent and dismiss me as fool! You see, I have a history of debating religious people, so such petty tricks dont work on me! If you cant hold a conversation or debate, and argue as intended, dont engage in such debates then!
eleminatus 4 months ago
@eleminatus Little girl? O.K. punk you want to see what a little girl can do to your face? I will be glad to meet you and have you say that to me face to face and you will learn some manners. Are you man enough or are you just a big talking punk?
billperron2 4 months ago
@billperron2 so now you switch to threats? You are pathetic! You proved to me that you cant hold an intellectual debate, that you dont understand the scientific inquiry, that you ignore the facts that dont support your own claims and now you prove that you are just another redneck! Only uneducated bring a fist fight into an intellectual conversation. No wonder you like astrology so much! When you get your information from stars and not science, thats what you get!
eleminatus 4 months ago
@eleminatus Kid don't you have a life? Quit badgering me, it was never an intellectual conversation, it was some punk ass kid bothering me because he has no respect for his own life. If really had a life you wouldn't waste one second of it on some guy who doesn't care who you are, what you think, or anything else about your life wasting opinions.
billperron2 4 months ago
@billperron2 this is getting better and better. I can see you are new to internet discussions so you keep on making these fallacies one after another. First, you tried to end a conversation with an assumed victory. Now you try to diminish me by calling me kid and call an internet conversation a waste of life. Besides being wrong on multiple levels, you are also a hypocrite! Or did you forget that you yourself are "wasting life" by typing out these replies?
eleminatus 4 months ago
@billperron2 people learn so much while conversing, while changing ideas and arguments. Thats why such forums exist. Thats why people comment here. Thats why I approached you. I asked simple questions and requests while providing arguments of my own. You did everything but answers those question, requests or arguments. If you dont know how to debate, especially on the web, dont engage in such debates. For now, all you do is make yourself look stupid, sir!
eleminatus 4 months ago
@eleminatus You are absolutely correct in everything you say and believe, I am stupid, I know nothing, I am a loser. Now please leave me the fuck alone.
billperron2 4 months ago
@billperron2 wow.. and you are supposed to be an adult here! Take care!
eleminatus 4 months ago
@billperron2 the fact that a single book is not evidence for anything is NOT an opinion; the fact that two other committees debunked statistical calculations of Gauquelin is NOT opinion; the fact that all kind of research is documented is NOT an opinion; the fact that astrology has no evidence is NOT an opinion! You dont care for THE TRUTH, you care for YOUR TRUTH! You ignore facts, dont address issues, dont have proof yet dare call others close-minded. You are a disgrace!
eleminatus 4 months ago
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@eleminatus I don't give a crap about your opinions, I told you that before, but now you have pissed me off, if you are looking for trouble look no further, I'm right here.
billperron2 4 months ago
@billperron2 you see, its ironic that you used the word pseudo-science, since astrology is one of them. Its simply not scientific. Can you provide any peer-reviewed papers on astrology? Can you provide approved research that follows the scientific method? Can you provide the social study where correlation between people and planets is present? NO! Such things dont exist! There is no valid study on the topic, there are no scientific proof, there are people like you who dont know better!
eleminatus 4 months ago
LOL! Based on 12 star patterns that someone claims looks like a fish, a scorpion, a bull, etc.
brendanmcwilliams 6 months ago
0:55 "or lovelife" (camera pans to drawing of mans ass) (awkward pause in narration)
JoesephKatana 7 months ago 16
Richard Dawkins is such dork hahaaahaaaa. seriously tho he does sound like salad fingers
adicakes 8 months ago
I most definitely consider Bill Nye to be damn sexy!
cavejourney 8 months ago
so i'm not a scorpio? i'm actually an offiucos? damn. i like scorpio. it's my favourite animal.
oh well, i never believed that horoscope crap anyways. it was always wrong.
aandreya 9 months ago
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2:16 yeah i think youre more of a sagitarius, Bill...
testnumberone1 9 months ago
And once again I explain, most astrology does nothing but tell you, "today will be a good day if you are considerate to your coworkers" "if you take the time to sit and relax you will find a new perspective." So again i ask you, what is the problem with this? Who gives a rat's pah-tooty if others care not about the stars shifting or whether or not astrology gives you a generalization? Hopeful doesnt mean theyll throw their money in something hoping for a new life. Come on peeps, ffs.
mattc851 9 months ago
Jeesh so many responses since I've been gone. Let me think for a second (sorry this process tends to take a bit.) Once again someone said the word hope, when I explained before that that i already said hopeful, there's a difference. These are smart people, of that I know is true. However I never said people should spend money on it, and you people being all uppidy won't change the minds of people who will, so me saying its not a bad thing hurts nothing.
mattc851 9 months ago
Well, that explains why the astrologists say that I'm a Capricorn, but I've always felt like a Sagittarius...
SexedUpAtheist 9 months ago
XD... it's so weird hearing Bill Nye say "sexy". I laughed when he coughed afterward.
Xearf 10 months ago
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is there people who actually believe in astrology?
pistolpete667 11 months ago
0:59 dat ass
hameed 11 months ago
Dawkins and Tyson, If I outlive them, I WILL be taking a drunken piss on there graves!
truthseeker010101 11 months ago
@truthseeker010101 you probably wont though. theyre brilliant scientists that know the workings of life and youre a retard who pees on tombstones
pistolpete667 11 months ago
@truthseeker010101 Their* graves? Fucking neanderthal. I'd piss on YOU'RE (notice I know how to imply possession properly) grave too. But unfortunately for me, you are a fucking nameless nobody.
And by the way neither of those two people live in ALABAMA. And I know for a fact you're hill billy ass can't navigate an airport, so I don't see how you could accomplish that.
Why don't you try reading a fucking book instead.
bushiyo2 9 months ago
@bushiyo2 Not that I'm trying to be a grammar nazi but YOU'RE = YOU ARE (Contraction) YOUR = BELONGING TO YOU (Possessive pronoun). Apostrophes used with pronouns ALWAYS indicate a contraction. Possessive pronouns NEVER have an apostrophe. As for my credentials...I have a Master's Degree in English and spent 10 years teaching Composition to college freshmen.
GottaStopKillin 8 months ago
@GottaStopKillin - give up now. Most folks do'nt care about there inglish and grama when they post. Apostophe's are put where they seem too fit to. Spell'n has know meanin two.
Ah that feels better.
ZoeMarks 8 months ago
and yet 7 people disliked this.. GET WITH THE PROGRAM!
zashev 1 year ago
TED.com has numerous great talks shining the light of truth on bilge like astrology.
Michael Shermer is one of the talk givers; The Amazing Randi also gives a good talk.
TED.COM
Bill Nye screwed up in his section. He should have flat out crushed astrology. As it is, he left the door open to the possibility that it still might be so...though there really ISN'T.
lancethrustworthy 1 year ago
TED.com has numerous great talks shining the light of truth on bilge like astrology.
Michael Shermer is one of the talk givers; The Amazing Randi also gives a good talk.
TED.COM
lancethrustworthy 1 year ago
To believe in astrology, really believe, is to demonstrate a passion for ignorance. Why should we care? Because there are people who make money out of this. There's a part of me that takes its hat off to them, but a bigger part of me thinks we should get rid of the market through a little education.
Faithlessandfree 1 year ago
wait... people actually believe this stuff?
santa clause and the tooth fairy are more logical than this shit
254fds 1 year ago
carl talking about the gravity of mars had me cracking up.
defect530 1 year ago
I always confuse Astronomy and Astrology. The names are so similar.
flubno 1 year ago
astrology works with the "barnum effect" it means that anything can match with any personality
go at wikipedia and look for Forer_effect
jam63112 1 year ago
@jam63112 This is what psychology and psychiatry do.
TheLogic1010 8 months ago
and i never said it gave them hope, i said it makes them hopeful, there is a very distinctive difference in the two, and being hopeful can never hurt, no matter the reason.
mattc851 1 year ago
@mattc851 Hopeful for what? Something that isn't going to happen. That's a false hope.
KLowD9x 1 year ago
@matc851
Making someone "hopeful" can come at a cost. Generally when one is prone to superstition and does not allow themselves to use critical thinking they become susceptible to hucksters of all sorts. People can waste their time with "hopeful" distractions when they could be doing something genuinely useful with their time. They can also fritter away their money. I have known many people with barely two dimes to scratch together that have wasted $ on astro readings and similar nonsense.
vadimcream 1 year ago
so get over your petty disputes, just let some people believe in it, astrology can only serve to make people hopeful and interested in daily life, as well as give good advice to them. so why again are you so against it?
mattc851 1 year ago
@mattc851 Because it is a false hope. If you want hope in your life, go make something of your life.
KLowD9x 1 year ago
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KLowD9x 1 year ago
@KLowD9x how is it false hope? incase you havent noticed theres no actual fortunes, horror scopes dont tell you if you go left your entire life will change and your become a millionaire. they tell you things like, if you compromise more today you will find people receive you better. next time think about what your discussing before you stick your foot in your mouth.
mattc851 1 year ago
@mattc851 It is false hope because they tell you nothing. Anyone can give you words of encouragement but there is no need to look to some pseudoscience horse shit for some inspiration.
Go talk to a friend if you need some advice, not a newspaper.
KLowD9x 1 year ago
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thecenterofwinter 1 year ago
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thecenterofwinter 1 year ago
Astrology blows but not more then this movie. These are the most ill formed and the least convincing arguments I have ever heard. Why don't you guys gain some intelligence and spend less time trying frantically to refute things that don't matter.
boardeleven 1 year ago
LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL
boardeleven 1 year ago
Wow you people have way too much time on your hands people. Look the abstract ideals of Astrology and horoscopes and such is merely a different way of thinking. Scientist love to this with their time and grants, they spend all that money and energy disproving things and telling the public they think the wrong things and everyone goes crazy over it, for or against. No one seems to want to think that the scientist just wasted a lot of time and money on doing absolutely nothing useful.
mattc851 1 year ago
And no matter what you say they really are wasting time and energy, I felt like throwing my computer after watching 9 minutes of these people babbling on about fact and fiction. I have no idea what kind of studies these people did, but I've done personality tests and psych evals in college and I fit no other sign than a Taurus, no matter what book I've read about astrology.
mattc851 1 year ago
@mattc851
" I've done personality tests and psych evals in college and I fit no other sign than a Taurus, no matter what book I've read about astrology."
Well you have heard that the earth has shifted over the course of the past few thousand years right and that recently an "official" statement was made that everyone is actually one sign different than they originally thought right? So you are in fact no longer Taurus at all. Still think it's so accurate?
vadimcream 1 year ago
@mattc851 And you've done nothing useful other than make yourself look defensive. If you have a valid argument for why your belief is valid and provable, then say so.
tjackso0 1 year ago
@tjackso0 if you perceived me as defensive then you really need to double check, i was agreeing with neither side, nor do i feel i need to provide a "valid" argument for this. i care nothing that you people so avidly disbelieve something that effects your life so little. if you dont believe in it then thats fine, not like its existence or people believing in it is hurting you. how many people here were beaten half to death or abused because of astrology? i bet you the answer is none.
mattc851 1 year ago
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mattc851 1 year ago
Carl Sagan, Richard Dawkins, Neil DeGrasse Tyson debunked astrology, and people still believe it? Three great scientists are wrong and people without first grade astronomy knowledge are right? People are pathetic
JLuvs0fficial 1 year ago 20
@JLuvs0fficial Ramen, brother!
ChuckyJesus666 11 months ago
@JLuvs0fficial Where is the scientifc study have these three scientists have debunked astrology? Where can I check that astrology has been debunked and see there results.? Was this study done under neutral scientific method procedures and independently checked. If not, then this video is flawed and not worthy of anything! Do NOT agree with any science opinion unless it can be backed up with evidence, proof and data presented. The only pseudoscience is believing in this video.
TheLogic1010 8 months ago
@TheLogic1010 Wait, wait, wait.. Are you calling Carl Sagan a pseudo-scientist? Neil DeGrasse? Hahahahahaha.. Did you even watch the video? They debunked astrology in the video. Did you not see when Richard Dawkins gave people the WRONG zodiac signs? Did you not see Neil DeGrasse's 2/3 test? Can you answer Richard Dawkins question? How can the position of the stars effect our physiology? Do stars, or DNA decide our personalities?
JLuvs0fficial 8 months ago
@JLuvs0fficial Yes, I'm calling all three pseudo scientists. They haven't debunked astrology. A personal biased opinion is non science. I don't think you read my comment. Saga, Dawkins and Degrasse have not done what science is all about. So therefore its a pseudo video. Can you show me the reference to the scientific study that these three under took to debunk astrology?? Once you have answered my criticism of this video, I can answer your questions!
TheLogic1010 8 months ago
@TheLogic1010 You're an idiot calling Carl Sagan a pseudo-scientist. He's done more for the scientific community than you will ever do, or any astrologer. Also, you obviously don't know what science is about, it's about test and experimentation, which they did by giving people the wrong horoscopes. That was an experiment testing its accuracy, which failed. Did you not hear Carl Sagan say "the only effect Mars can have on us is its gravity."
JLuvs0fficial 8 months ago
@JLuvs0fficial I would be very careful to call anyone an idiot. With regards to Carl Sagan he is not out of limits to criticism. I will ask you, do you know what science is?? When did astrology ever say that gravity was involved?? You have a lot to think about mr scientist?
TheLogic1010 8 months ago
@TheLogic1010 For someone whose moniker is "TheLogic" you sure don't use any. You're an idiot, with no merit to call Sagan a pseudoscientist. Albert Einstein said astrology was "pseudo-science" and "superstitious", is he a pseudoscientist as well? Just because people oppose your view doesn't make them a pseudoscientist. There have been tons of large-scale studies attempting to prove the accuracy of astrology, all which have failed
JLuvs0fficial 8 months ago
(cont) as for your questions. Yes, I know what science is, I am a scientist (neuroscientist). You obviously don't know what science is, because astrology is a pseudoscience. As for my comment regarding gravity, planets do NOT emit energy, so the only way Mars can effect us is by its gravity. You never answered my question. Do stars, or DNA decide our personality? How can planetary positioning effect our physiology.
JLuvs0fficial 8 months ago
@JLuvs0fficial I would think it is quite embarassing for yourself to admit to being a scientist? Astrology is no pseudoscience, your ignorance isn't. Jupiter emits energy, radiowaves infact. Not really good at this science stuff, are we? The professors at Oxford university are now answering how the planets affect physiology. To answer your question about DNA and astrology would obviously be too deep for you to understand. Gravity is not involved in astrology. So have another go mr scientist?
TheLogic1010 8 months ago
@TheLogic1010 I never said gravity is involved in astrology, you imbecile. Learn how to fucking read. I find it quite embarrassing you think you are smart, haha. Where are the papers from Oxford stating planets can affect our physiology? I tried to search for them, but couldn't find them anywhere.. Lastly, I may not be a physicist, but I am knowledgeable in regards to DNA. I know the only factors involved in personality is DNA, and epigenetics. Or can you prove me wrong?
JLuvs0fficial 8 months ago
@JLuvs0fficial So what did you mean about gravity? Swearing won't make you sound any cleverer! Others who have looked for the reference about the 2 oxford professors have found the source, we're not very bright are we? We know your no physicist! Astrology has proved you wrong, but you don't get!!
TheLogic1010 8 months ago
@JLuvs Listen, I know your not very bright but I will endulge your stupidity. My comment was someone who call's themselves a scientist but doesn't look scientifically at astrology and holds bias, personal views is a pseudoscientist. DO YOU UNDERSTAND? Direct me to the source of your comments of Einstein's views about astrology? Listen again, my argument is not about anyone disageeing with my view. It's the lack of scientific objectivity. No neutral, unbiased study has ever disproved astrology.
TheLogic1010 8 months ago
@TheLogic1010 Like I said, YOU'RE an idiot. (I find it funny you say I'm not bright when you're using incorrect homonyms). In order for a field to be considered scientific, it has to be parsimonious, empirically testable and falsifiable, progressive, correctable and dynamic, consistent and tentative. Astrology doesn't fit ANY prerequisites, thus making astrology pseudoscience. Having a personal bias DOES NOT make one a pseudoscientist
JLuvs0fficial 8 months ago
@JLuvs0fficial I think you need to look closer home. Who ever said that astrology wanted to be considered scientific? You can includ yourself as a psuedoscientist. Having personal biases is unscientific. Again, you don't get it. Am I writing to a child?
TheLogic1010 8 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@TheLogic1010 "No neutral, unbiased study has ever disproved astrology."
The Forer effect.
cornflakeclusters 5 months ago
JLuvs0fficial 8 months ago
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TheLogic1010 8 months ago
@JLuvs0fficial Yes, I have seen this letter published and therefore it could be true? What I have in answer, if Albert Einstein wrote these words and believed astrology to be a pseudoscience, does that mean that he was also correct with his views on quantum theory?
TheLogic1010 8 months ago
2:00 Sagittarius good jesus you're ugly
daeviel 1 year ago
The zodiac signs are actually a mystery nothing can prove the idea wrong, so fuck off stupid concrete thinkers
Daavisonfire 1 year ago
@Daavisonfire
Nothing can prove Santa Clause wrong neither, I guess you believe in Santa Clause as well huh? Astrology is nothing but pseudoscience and is easily debunked
JLuvs0fficial 1 year ago
3 people still have their heads up their asses.
wakeupfist 1 year ago
HAHA!! This is what happens when repairmen start flying the plane.... IT CRASHES!!
#1- Astrology and Horoscopes are NOT the same.
#2- Twins born minutes apart - the aspects and angles of the planets relative to one another are PERPETUALLY in flux, expressed as degrees and minutes. Thus, there are an incredibly large number of potential combinations of aspects the planets and other astral bodies can form as a complete snapshot at any moment in time.
#3- Ignorant dumbasses
vegeteriancannibal 1 year ago
@vegeteriancannibal
If that is so then what is it about the planets alignment that has the effect on us? As Sagan states, the gravitational pull of Mars is less substantial than the gravitational pull of everyday objects within our immediate vicinity, so it's clearly not gravity.
vadimcream 1 year ago
@vadimcream Yes, Absolutely right question.... there's sometimes a hype about the gravitational pull of the planets and now there is another theory about the electro magnetic field of the planets but hear now the truth about astrology...
Astrology is simply the science (STUDY) of behavorial patterns in humans in accordance with the Cosmic movement... THAT'S IT!!! Who know what is it about the damn planets that does affect us... Everything affects everything... CONTINUED
vegeteriancannibal 1 year ago
@vegeteriancannibal The idea that the planetary movements don't affect us is non feasable in accordance with modern science itself because, modern psycology suggests that there are circumstances, visual and audio that though not focused on by the subject particulary, leaves and imprint on the subconcious mind and therefore influences his decisions and behaviour... Haven't you watched Derren Brown? CONTINUED
vegeteriancannibal 1 year ago
@vegeteriancannibal Astrology tried to study weather or not cosmic movements also influence human behaviour and found many behaviourial patterns that were directy in link with the cosmic movements, that's it. Everything in the Universe affects everything, Astrology is a study to find if there is a system to it and the findings have been astounding however, because of the infamy that Blind Believers of Randomness have deterred on Astrology, people have no idea what astrology really is!!
vegeteriancannibal 1 year ago
@vegeteriancannibal
All of the claims you've made are completely unsubstantiated. They have not been verified by any stretch of the imagination and merely typing them out with exclamation points doesn't make them at all true.
And BTW look up the word "deter", it doesn't mean what you think it does.
vadimcream 1 year ago
@vadimcream Funny, I thought deter meant oppose and funnier because I research on astrology and so far I have learnt which you can verify with any astrology institution in the world that astrology was and always will be comparing cosmic movements with human behaviour and finding a pattern.... what is so difficult to understand here... astrology may have many forms but as far as I know, Vedic Astrology is just this. CONTINUED
vegeteriancannibal 1 year ago
@vegeteriancannibal Does the movement of celestial bodies in the cosmos affect Human behaviour? Well that's still the study, why does it affect Human behaviour, many theories but still Unknown. Sorry, I only keep saying Human behaviour but it's also, planetary positions exerting positive and negative energies (so to speak) to create favourable and unfavourable times for select actions.
Go to wikipedia to learn more
P.s. English is not my first language!
vegeteriancannibal 1 year ago
@vegeteriancannibal
Ok, well considering English isn't your first language I'll cut you some slack and compliment you on how well you do express yourself... But other than that I'm surprised you brought up Derren Brown before as he is a renowned sceptic and does not believe astrology one bit... Next, nothing is "difficult to understand", it's just that, like I said, you throw out all of these dubious claims as if they are a matter of proven fact and they are anything but... CONTINUED.
vadimcream 1 year ago
Celestial bodies effecting us? Planetary positions "exerting pos and neg energies"? These things sound nice but they are not rooted in any fact of any kind. Yes there are many who make the same claims as you, but random claims aren't facts.
And FYI, I have read up extensively on astrology. I grew up in a household that was very open to these sorts of things. I used to believe, but once I applied logic to it and read up on the available facts, I let go of that superstitious belief.
vadimcream 1 year ago
@vadimcream Then it's a shame you couldn't grasp the essence of astrology even with all that resources and still don't get it!! Put more logic into it and think of what i am saying.... there are various types of astrology now, how many of them do you really know about?? Vedic astrology began as a simple observation of planetary movements with different earthly behaviours, just like how we see a pattern of how many people tend to sleep during the night and work during the day, it's just that...
vegeteriancannibal 1 year ago
@vegeteriancannibal what facts are we at all talking about? There were thoussands if not 100s of thousand observations made and many of them show a distinct pattern which is why it still exists today...... of course, i give up if it is the usual quack astrologers in abundance everywhere now is what you are talking about but in India, there is a foundation that has been preserving the knowledge for 100s of years... wait a bit, i'll post some sources for you to go through.
vegeteriancannibal 1 year ago
@vegeteriancannibal en.wikipedia . org / wiki/Hindu_astrology
srisivanadi com
rameshguru net
The other two websites look really cheesy but just try and understand the concept of vedic astrology from these sources. And like i said, i don't know what it is about the celestial bodies in the cosmos that influences the earthly behaviours but the study still is about weather or not it actually does affect earthly behaviours... Certain patterns found keeps it alive
vegeteriancannibal 1 year ago
@vegeteriancannibal
These things do not add up to a "distinct pattern". That's just the problem with things like astrology, when submitted to double blind testing it's never been shown to display considerable predictive power. The patterns that you and others think are there are self imposed, which is why a room filled with people of all different signs can be given the same exact reading and all of them can feel as if their reading is spot on.
CONTINUED
vadimcream 1 year ago
I have a question for you though. Do you think that astrology operates through scientific or supernatural principals?
vadimcream 1 year ago
@vadimcream 1st, it's called barnum statements that are statements that anyone can relate to, 2nd... looking at different birth charts and telling a doctor that he/she is in the medical field withouht knowing that he/she was a doctor and telling an engineer he is into construction withouht knowing he is an engineer is NOT Barnum Statements, Clearly you have absolutely no idea about astrology apart from western astrology (No Offence) Continued...
vegeteriancannibal 1 year ago
@vegeteriancannibal
As for the birth charts thing. Please show me legitimate documentation of it consistantly having the predictive power to correctly guess people's occupation. I can believe that those instances would be true if they are cherry picked from hundreds of readings and happen to be the ones that were true through coincidence; but until you show me real evidence I'm going to assume this is just an empty claim you are making.
vadimcream 1 year ago
@vadimcream Hmm... very good point.... DOCUMENTATION you say, are you bloody nuts!!! Astrology till date is not considered a science, it's considered a psuedo-science so how can i show you any documentations? I'll tell you why though astrology is considered a psuedo science, it is because there are so many damn variations of it! Proof of consistant predictive power in VEDIC Astrology though, i must say, i don't bloody have any do you know why, BECAUSE IT HAS NOT BEEN DOCUMENTED YET!!! Continued.
vegeteriancannibal 1 year ago
@vegeteriancannibal the only proof i can give you is that there is but a study of the vedic astrology whereby you can learn what position of which planet on which houses mean what therefore, go document it yourself and then YOU prove it that it's all bullshit!!
vegeteriancannibal 1 year ago
@vegeteriancannibal
"DOCUMENTATION you say, are you bloody nuts!!! ".
Look man, you were the one who made the claim about Vedic astrology predicting people's unique careers. If you don't want to provide proof of these statements then don't make them in the first place and don't get in a huff when you are expected to back them up.
vadimcream 1 year ago
@vadimcream Lastly, if you think astrology operates through SUPERNATURAL principals then i end my discussion right here, thank you!
vegeteriancannibal 1 year ago
@vegeteriancannibal
No, I don't believe in the supernatural period.
I was asking this to determine how you thought celestial bodies have an effect on us. It's been proven that the gravitational pull of far away objects have less effect on us than objects within our immediate vicinity (sagan explains this in the video we are commenting on). So how does it effect us so profoundly? And what of the shifting of the earth in the last 2000 years making us all off one full sign?
vadimcream 1 year ago
@vadimcream 1st, i didn't say you believe in supernatual things, you asked me if astrology is based on supernatural principles and i said that if YOU believe that astrology is based on supernatural beliefs then our discussion is over.... 2nd, have you at all not been reading what i have been writing, i keep telling you that we don't know what energies or forces of the celestial bodies astrology believs influences earthly behaviours but it sees a pattern in the coinciding movements between us..
vegeteriancannibal 1 year ago