?.....he is a chicken, i remember the days in holland during a seminar and some well known MMA guys wanted to fight him, and he chickened out!! i was THERE. a seminar with the Dutch sifu from holland... I trained 3 years under emin & came to realise he is a fake heroe. he claims (700!!????)streetfights and won without a scratch. i was a bouncer and never ever you can come to 700 fights!! only when your crazy!! liar!
lol there is a comment missing by me so the laughter of minasz makes no sense. He laughed because I said my WT Sifu was a MT teacher for 15 years before sticking complete to WT. And yes it is true. Maybe I removed the comment in accident. but who cares Dr Zeus seems like a great guy. So I stop spamming now.
@jomushin7 as you can see, I let comments stay, no matter what fools say. I haven't deleted anything unless it had extremely vulgar language.
as to Thai Boxing etc.. WT people have been open to sparring folks for along time....many videos's of it, several MMA champs in Europe, etc... People are fighters, not styles.......and EVERYBODY SUCKS.....so go train.
@minasz so and why was my teacher 15 years muay thai teacher before he completely moved to WT and always said Emin is a sick badass? And how do you know that I didn't train MT in my youth?
@minasz whatever. I think you didn't train any MTB or anything other. I trained a lot of Martial arts. Not MT but also boxing and kickboxing and a lot of other stuff in my youth. You seem just like a silly MMA fanboy who never trained anything. So who cares.
Emin has good wing chun, but not my respect. He looks like a punk ass kid showing off. Anywho, come check out my iron fist anyone who lives in New South Wales.. message me for contact and meet.
@silicon605 Wing Tzun is about training hard and developping skills,senses and soul combined.
silicon605 does your words sound like some true martial artists critics?
If you criticisize somebody by his/her character is one thing, but if you do that by his work or art is another thing.
Please decide which one do you want to do? I can't answer for my Sifu about his character but I can answer for his style or art. And I am trusting in his skills.
@silicon605 I am training in EBMAS Wing Tzun for years. Now if you critisize Sifu Emin Boztepe you should have same knowledge as he does...
Okay. I assume you do. I believe Sifu Fred Kwok is a great person and martial artist.
But I ask you silicon605 have you watched Sifu Emin's other videos? Besides have you ever seen him in action or in seminar? Have you practiced chi sau with him? Well... He is very fast and his senses are amazing. I can say this because I trained with many sifus.
@silicon605 Good grief, why so harsh man? Cant the man have a bit of fun on camera? BTW, if you think his wing chun is no good, why don't you take one of his classes? Or challenge one of his students to a friendly sparring match? Just a thought.
You dont know what you are speaking about, That is the problem with learning you westerners anything you create dogmas based on your own bealives. Wingchun have nothing to do with your ebalives it is principles of couse and effect yin yang in action as meditation in movment.
wasnt his biggest claim to fame appearin in some shit movie wiht cythia rothrock lol
every clip i watched of emin fail is the same smaller opponents sloppy technique... he has shown the world nothing new about wing chun...he isnt even part of the true wing chun lineage...thats why that branch of wing chun changed to ving tsun....means reject's of wing chun...lmfao...soo true....dr zeus you talk total shite also.
@WUHELLRAZOR when you fall in life, and start to spit hate on a free video site, do your homework, or you'll fail even at the web. small, or large, better WT knowledge will mess you up. some WT si-fu's are very small, have you seen their videos? guess not. also, you never had a chance to attend a WT class, right? lineage? what's that, like underwear? he OWNS his own sport. either you fail again, or his thousands of hands on students know LESS than you are. which one is it?
Sounds to me like kommisar knows what he's talking about. I've noticed also that he is very careful to be respectful to WC, he's just disdainful of some of its practitioners. Speaking of balls, has your sifu ever stepped into the octagon?
kommisar has commented on almost every wing tzun chun video on utube sayin how its a crap useless martial art...d fag has nutin better 2 do but badmouth sifu emin......get his dates of his seminars and go and prove d "fraud" he is.......as i sed before i cud use a gud laugh...seriously wit all ur expertise in the martial arts beatin sifu shud b no proablem 2 any of u.....EBMAS 4 LIFE
Why would he? Most of the WT techniques are against the rules in UFC? A better question would be if any WT people are fighting with a modified WT in Cage contests.
Again, you lie. There's nothing here that's not allowed under unified MMA rules -- not ONE thing. I love this bullshit about "rules" you LARPers always make, as if if WC can't hit the guy in the balls or eyes it's completely useless. Even then, we never see a chunner do any of this shit. You fags barely even spar if at all. This video is a perfect testament to that.
Yeah, imagine that: you chunners would have to "modify" your crappy art so that it actually works. Hahaha!
You don't video sparring because it looks nothing like any of the "techniques" you brag about doing or show in the video. I've seen plenty of WC fights or sparring matches and never once have I seen any of your "street" moves or even your silly trapping; doesn't exist. It merely exists in your fantasy-addled, deluded minds and faggotty play acting. You can show Boztepe flexing his biceps and yet you can't show any of your "eye gouges". Telling....
WT doesn't do "Trapping" that is JKD and WC. Anyway, as I said previous, I see many MMA training tools that they do not do in the ring, such as hitting tires, pulling elastic ropes, grappling with no striking, striking with no grappling, focus mitt work, etc....So training does not make for one to one transitions to fighting.
further more, modern personal training involves numerous development exercises for sports that look nothing like the sport. Sorry you are not able make this connection
Horseshit. Your silly patty cake routine in the video says otherwise. Boztpe even says he trains trapping.
Those MMA "tools" are conditioning and training to isolate certain skills. Even when they grapple with no striking, it still becomes integrated in their fighting when they get into the ring, unlike WC nonsense. You haven't fought a day in your life. Go study dancing or something; fighting isn't for you.
That is true about judo groundfighting being what BJJ was based on, apparently, as I've read practitioners of both BJJ and Judo refer to it.
However, I've never heard of any of the Gracies walk into someone else's school and attack them, or ever seen them trying to impress students with their physique.
You refer to the Cheung/Boztepe fight? William Cheung had an open challenge to fight "anyone anytime", but avoided all takers. He then would claim that no one would except his challenge. WT people tried to arrange a fight but Cheung claimed it could only be with those of his "seniority", of which there was no one, since Leung Ting, the founder of WT was under his age in seniority. Boztepe merely attended a Cheung seminar and then waited for him to announce his open challenge, and took it.
I've stated repeatedly in the past that I too agree that Cheung is a fraud, a pussy and a douchebag, and he still is. You don't need to beat a dead horse. The point is Boztepe had the upper hand on Cheung as Cheung was smaller, older and was sucker attacked. Neither fighter used any "WC" in that fight as it looked like a typical playground fight. Seriously, tell us that is the mark of a WC expert. Please point to us the "WC techniques" Boztepe used in that embarrassing scuffle.
Boztepe today is older then Cheung was then, yet people still expect him to go into the cage, so that "old man" BS won't fly here. I could point to several things but I do agree it was a sloppy fight and it is a shitty video.
Randy Couture is Boztepe's age and Renzo Gracie is only 5 years younger. Hell, Tank Abbott is 44 and he has horrible conditioning, yet all those guys still fight. Boztepe has no excuse; he's never proven his bullshit works in a real fight against a live opponent. His patty cake and rehearsed routines only impress credophiles like you.
Go on, point to one thing "WC" in that video. You still haven't I noticed. I thought your WC was meant "for the street".
No one stated BJJ and judo are worlds apart. Helio and Carlson Gracie merely modified the JJ Carlson was taught by Maeda. They didn't reinvent the wheel. There has been much documentation on this that there's not much to discuss about it.
Yes, the Gracies challenged other people to fights and then video taped them. Boztepe did that ONE time, and as soon as his Cheung blew him off he hit him from behind and threw his years of WC training out the windo. Boztepe is an asshole and a fraud.
Mmm, no, Cheung actually claims Boztepe attacked him while his back was turned. Either way, Boztepe looked like a fucking puss. We definitely didn't see any of that stuff that's "against UFC rules". Why is that? Where are all the "illegal" techniques you WC bozos so proudly brag of? Seems like a bunch of LARPing since you never seem to actually do it.
Wrong. The gossip whores repeat that, but his statement talks about a kick to Boztepes knee and how the slippers and floor caused him (Cheung) to slide away backwards.
I really don't care to look into it. Boztepe had the upper hand no matter how you slice it: he came ready to fight and was bigger, stronger and faster than Cheung. He even had him on the ground in a very dominant position and did nothing. Both douchebags are frauds who showed the reality of their so-called "fighting skills". Why didn't Boztepe take out Cheung with an eye gouge or something like that that you LARPers claim you do all the time?
"Eye poke" was just one example, which is why I followed it with "etc.". You WC clowns are always saying the rules prevent your "techniques" from working in full-contact competitions, including NHB. Here's a silly statement of yours:
"UFC rules prevent anti-grap due to the restrictions around kicking downed opponents and striking the neck with elbows."
So in other words you guys elbow each other in the neck and kick each other in the head while on the ground? Please show that in your video.
kommisar u r a fukin idiot....first of as regards 2 boztepe "copying" bjj into his martial art and sayin he robbed it is like sayin bruce lee was a thief wen he made jeet kune do....dere is not a wing tzun/chun/tsun vid on utube dat u havnt commented on...i can only guess from dis dat u r sad and have no life
No, they're not the same, you stupefied fucktard. Bruce actually credits the arts where he took the techniques from to incorporate into his system. Boztepe actually says that's a part of WC and always has been. The difference is me saying I quoted someone vs. quoting them and then saying I came up with that passage. You're a gullible, uneducated, LARPing retard who lacks any solid education. Go back to your anime, you dipshit.
boztepe's a faggott...his fighting techiniques are all out of co~ordination and his instruction is poor....hes all about the muscles and clearly has limited skill/techinuque. my granny could beat this fool.
I removed your rude and graphic sexual comments and ebmasdan92s replies. Wuellbarrow you can talk all the trash you want but keep it clean, children read this stuff.
I am not sure now as the Europeans duplicated a lot of our changes. EBMAS had a more comprehensive single arm program, gives more sooner, and has more Latosa Escrima mixed in if you like.
example; WT single arm only had the basic 3 pairs and kwan sau with step, EBMAS has single arm sets all the way up to 8th student grade matching all the root moves needed into 2nd tech.
but really we still respect the heart of Leung Ting Wing Tsun. To paraphrase, "The Ting is dead, long live the King!"
yes reason is lost on most of them.....that's why I always .....shut up and sign a waiver....been a street fighter my entire life and I'm Irish-American Indian....busting heads is in my blood....lolto bad so many are more concerned about trophies and less about training for real :-((
Greetings dr tzeus i am student of ebmas and here ur wasting ur time wit dese fags who type shit bou boztepe.....if he is so shit and dere so great let dem fight boztepe and beat em in front of a camera....u can find d dates on d ebmas page.....
Well, it is a waste, but if someone doesn't provide the real story, then these gossip whores are all that gets heard. We were very secretive about stuff in the past so now outside of Europe, more people have only heard the lies from these knuckle heads.
Especially that Sifu Emin backed out of the Gracie Challange. I was a student of his back then and I watched the whole thing unfold, as well as doing research on it for the last ten years. It is very clear that the Gracies backed out, not Emin.
well i only joined ebmas in january(i train in ireland) so am not sure on d gracies fight.....regardless of who baked out of d fite emin or d gracies wat dese steroid pumpin fools need 2 realise is dat ebmas wing tzun is for STREET self defence....if i wanted 2 fite an mma fighter i wud take up mma....i want 2 know how to defend myself effectivly so i do ebmas wing tzun.....i am not sayin mma wont defend u on d streets but ebmas wing tzun does it 4 me....
Ya, I agree. Si-fu says for most to ignore the internet stuff as it has lead to several challenge events. It's just words and we shouldn't fight over words, only to defend our lives. He doesn't even read this stuff because it gets him upset. He ask me years ago to continue defending our honor in the internet forums so we have at least one voice of reason out here.
Still supporting the lies of your fraudulent "sifu" I see. Well, you've been a credulous idiot who lives in fantasy this long so you're most likely beyond hope by now.
The letter exchange between the Gracies' side and Boztepe is on line for anyone to view. The Gracies offered several times to pay for Boztepe's expenses to fight in the UFC and he refused. He's a pussy and his fight with Cheung is positive proof of such. You're a LARPing, credulous jackass -- the perfect Bzotepe student.
Neither the Graces nor Boztepe could find a way to make that fight happen. Why do you put all the blame on Boztepe? Because he didn't want to fight on PayPerView? It was the Gracie Camp that refused the last neutral location at a magazine publisher studio, not Emin, yet you and everyone else blame Emin for it? At the very least you must admit that NEITHER party let it happen, not blame it all on Boztepe.
Hmm, interesting that Boztepe has no problem going on talk shows, appearing on local TV news, starring in movies and putting up dozens of videos of his silly WC techniques, and yet he has a huge problem doing the one thing he claims he can do very well, on TV: fight. He has no problem bragging about all his other, past fights but as soon as he has to do one which people can actually watch, he finds a way to cower out. Typical LARPing fraud behavior right there. He's a loser and so are you.
In each of your televised examples he is NOT HURTING PEOPLE ON PURPOSE. Further more the Gracies REFUSED a venue that did not allow them to make money off of the fight film. So this is the difference, that Horion wanted to make money off peoples pain and injury and Boztepe did not.
You just don't get it do you? Anything else?
Anything more current, like how even Horion Gracie walked away from UFC because it has to many restrictions, yet you STILL expect Emin to go fight in it.
Boztepe brags about his "300 bare knuckle street fights" as a way of marketing himself and his teachings but he has a problem with prize fighting? That makes zero fucking sense and only a credulous buffoon like you would buy into that bullshit.
Boztepe would get killed in the UFC now, even with the added rules. That being said, yes, it would be VERY nice if he went in there for a fight.
Face it, the man is a cheap fraud and you're a fucking patsy.
Thats it, the "300 fights thing". You realize those were all before the William Cheung thing, so in the 1970's and early 1980's, and that he stopped fighting after that as people called him a "thug" for it.
o, maybe you don't realize that people can change, and that SOME people may not ENJOY fighting......but thats not fraud, unless you can prove he didn't have those fights. Seems that would have been done by now if it could be eh?
If he's ashamed of his former "thug" life, he should not be bragging about it in order to boost his credibility. Then again, the man is arrogant beyond compare. Just the way he mugs for the camera, beats up his stupefied, compliant students with a smile and basically acts like the asshole he is testifies to this.
Anyway, the "300 street fight" claim is bogus. No scars, no losses, no record of any kind? Only a credulous idiot would swallow that bullshit, which explains why you believe it.
Helio also claimed he "never lost", even though he did.
Sifu Emin has several knife and bullet scars, but again, you prove you are just making it up as you go and that you have no knowledge of this subject except the gossip you and your whores whisper into each others ears.....
Further more, I haven't heard him talk about his past accept to say he has the experience. It is that other Martial Art system that uses fighting in a cage to sell contracts about self defense.
Bullshit. Helio never said such thing. You're getting very desperate here, making up shit out of thin air.
And those bullet and knife scars prove only that he was wounded by those things, not that he won a bunch of street fights involving them. It's really simple: your "sifu" proves his system works against resisting opponents, not his idiots, credulous, stupefied and compliant students. He either does this or he doesn't; there is no gray areas or in-between's.
He didn't prove shit as evidenced by that horrible fight with Cheung. He's a fraud whose only recorded fight showed he sucks ass.
You can talk mock me for my lack of videos all you want; it's your "sifu" who is the one claiming to be a badass and charging money for lessons; the burden of proof rests on him.
"So is BJJ a sport? Then it is Judo."
You were making a sports reference, asshole. That's why I brought up the rules. You evidently can't form a logical argument.
Please elaborate on what you mean by "fraudulent". This is a very serious charge and one would expect some substantial proof of this. So far all you have done here is repeat old gossip and rumors or express half of the story as an opinion.
His "anti-grappling" program for one. He claims this is part of WC but really it's nothing but a watered-down version of BJJ he ripped off. His claim about his street fights is obviously bogus. He's not a fighter. Yup, sounds like a fraud to me.
Actually he created it and it is taught in Wing Tsun so yes it is part of WT. Further more all of the movements in the Anti-grappling program are the same movements used in the regular standing program, just changed to fit the new geometry on the ground, so even if your claim in true, that it is from BJJ, it has been made to fit Wing Tsun using WT techniques and tactics.
BJJ ripped off Feldenkrais Judo anyway, get over it.....it is called progress.
No, he didn't create it. He fucking ripped it off another system and then said it's part of WC. It's total plagiarism. The funny part though is that he sucks at it. Any decent BJJ fighter would pass Boztepe's pathetic "guard".
Wrong. BJJ is modified JJ. That's a known and very well documented fact, and I wouldn't bitch as much if your fraud "sifu" just manned up for once in his pathetic, cowardly life and admit he ripped off BJJ to capitalize on the BJJ boom.
Really? JJ eh? So it is a fluke then that Feldenkrais "Higher Judo, Ground Fighting" book, 1952, is EXACTLY the same as original Gracie BJJ. You continue to prove you are ignorant and I would like you to stop writing graffiti on my wall, unless you have something new to say.
Assuming what you're saying is true, it is actually since the Gracies developed their system long before that (although they may have been still perfecting it in the 50's). In fact, Helio Gracie was fighting in official vale tudo fights in the 30's.
Hmm, so it's alright for Boztepe to make a vague claim about how he "has experience" to sell his bullshit but the Gracies are wrong to sell their system by referring to actual examples of it being used? Nice job on showing us you're a retard.
When did I say the Gracie system was wrong? Just because I argue against your bullshit claims towards Emins character does't create an inverse toward BJJ or Gracie JJ. Now Horion I think got his bluff called and he backed down from the fight with Emin in the end to save Royce from damage. Otherwise, WTF are you talking?
It was all JJ before Kano made it into Judo, a sport. So is BJJ a sport? Then it is Judo. It fits the Judo model exactly, just called JJ as another sales gimmic.
What the hell are you babbling about, freak? You claimed BJJ was a rip-off of some other art and Helio denied he ever lost a fight. Both are categorically untrue and it comes as no surprised that upon being challenged for proof you try to change the subject. Typical WC behavior.
Boztepe wasn't interested in fighting Royce, so how the hell did Rorion save Royce, fucktard? Besides, Royce would have owned that sorry punk. Boztepe couldn't fight his way out of a baklava crust.
It was claimed that BJJ was "undefeated" and thus the "Ultimate" at one point, even though Helio's team threw in the towel. Helio said, which I respect, that he would have died first and so was not defeated as a man, but his team through in the towel. Thus a Gracie loss.
Just to make sure here, are you saying you like the way Horion promoted BJJ?
and you can imagine who would have owned who, but we will never know.....
How I like Rorion's promotion of his family's art has nothing to do with this. My only concern is you proving your ridiculous claims. You said Helio said he was never beaten and that BJJ is the same thing as judo. You have proven neither; you've only said incoherent nonsense as a sign of weakness and delusion. Perhaps you are in need of some professional mental help? Think about it.
I have the "Higher Judo: Ground Work" book right here, and it is EXACTLY what I was taught in a Carlsen BJJ school and is almost exactly what I have here in a Machado BJJJ book. BJJ=judo ground fighting. Nothing wrong with that.
I can look for the Helio interview, but I would rather train......
You don't know shit about BJJ. I know this because you claim Boztepe's "anti-grappling" bullshit works and is not a rip-off of BJJ. You can read least part of the book online. None of the illustrations even showed so much as a guard pass or a back mount escape. You're as full of shit as your fraud "sifu".
Bullshit. They had gis before judo. You're wrong again.
Helio's defeat to Kimura was published in a Brazilian newspaper -- and you're saying he denied this??? You're a fucking loser.
again, you fail at reading. The interview I mentioned has Helio saying he was never defeated as a man, meaning spiritually. He didn't trough in the towel, his team did, so he can say this. He never gave up.
However, early UFC propaganda read that BJJ was undefeated. This was true in UFC but they worded it to sound like they had never ever been defeated.
I'm not going to scroll back to your original imbecilic comment. You said Helio claimed he was never defeated, correct? You never mentioned anything about "spiritually" or whatever bullshit. My guess is you realized you were wrong and backpedalled. Wouldn't surprise me as you've shown you support fraud.
The quoted Wiki article is on the judogi. Gis are not all the same, fool. A judogi is different from a jiujitsugi for example. I referred to the gi as a whole, not the one for judo.
" Jigoro Kano derived the original judogi from the kimono and other Japanese garments around the turn of the 20th century, and as such the judogi was the first modern martial arts training uniform."
so, who is wrong again? They were tearing apart each others jackets so they modified thick firemens kimonos.
Wrong again, douchetard. Judo's rules and skill set are different from BJJ, so are its approaches to fighting. For example, in BJJ if you are thrown on your back you don't automatically lose the fight as in judo. Likewise, judo doesn't allow for stalls nearly as much as BJJ as the fighters are stood up very quickly. The judo then differed from the judo today and was based more on traditional JJ. You again show your appalling ignorance and delusion. Get help, you tool.
What? Don't try to get all technical with sport rules here. I am talking about techniques, not rules which let the ref stop the fight for you....bitch.
But as you say, Judo is based on JJ, as is BJJ. Tell me, which style was it that introduced the Gi to the sport? ....and thus you see that in fact JUDO is the root of BJJ.
They use gis even in traditiona JJ, dumbass. Besides, that's irrelevant; you made the statement that BJJ = judo, not that judo is its root. Again, the credulous WC retard fucks up and makes a dumbass argument.
"It"? So you're saying "it" made the claim? Again, your lack of intelligence makes itself known. You said before that Helio claimed he never loss. You still haven't proven this. Your rhetoric is very poor, as are you fighting skills.
I saw Helio make the statement in an interview, I heard it pronounced often in the early UFC days. I still here it about Royces "White Out" event since they through in the towel before the action started in that round, but sports wise it was still a loss.
You still haven't "proven" my Sifu is an Asshole or a fraud either.
@DrTzeus dr tzeus please delete d comments from kommisar i have seen him on every vid on utube for wing chun/tsun/tzun and its always d same shite he says....im afraid u jus cant get through 2 an idiot like dat
Kommi blocked for a week, so he can have a high school Graduate help him figure this out.
I warned him not to use the Cheung fight as an example of Boztepes fighting skill currently, or even back under the UFC challenge days, but he really fails at reading comprehension.
If I am wrong someone let me know. I don't mind other opinions but he was not really meeting me half way.
Boztepe could change to focus on training for cage fights, but he would have to modify what techniques we use to fit the rules and then train them in the Wing Tzun way. But then he couldn't teach.
and it wouldn't be WT anymore so it wouldn't really prove anything except that he is a strong fighter. We all ready know that.....
also, he has an ethical issue with fighting for money. Hurting people for money, in a way of thinking about it, is the LAST career a Martial Artist should strive for.
I love WC, but, I also realize unless someone knows what it's like to be hit&to hit in a competition, they R going 2 have less of a chance of overcoming adrenaline rush in midst of a real fight on streets.There's enough involved w/WCthat it can be used in ring. I personally think there might be a belief that if he loses, he might lose credibility & it could hurt him financially & possibly lose /respect. I'm not going to judge intentions, but it seems a cop out to say one won't fight for $
Even if he lost, I don't think it's a reason to lose face; it just means the other guy might be better at what he does or it could be luck, whoever got the best shot in; it's not necessarily a judgement of the art if one loses. LIke when Boztepe attacked GM Cheung (edited video),it doesn't change how good Cheungs art is, it might just have to do with him growing older in the art. Not too many older masters can beat their younger students in a fight, but they 'know' more & can teach the younger.
I disagree with this other comment of yours. He would lose face if he got his ass kicked. This bullshitter is always going on about how street-experienced he is, how he's had over 300 bare knuckle street fights, had to fight off bullies as a kid, etc. How's it going to look when an MMA practitioner of a few years makes him look like a joke?
Cheung was still practicing WC at the time of that fight, and despite his life-long practicing of it he didn't use it AT ALL in that fight. What a fraud
I saw a post elsewhere by someone who claimed to be there & related Boz pulled his pants down to his ankles 1st & he related some other details, edited film, etc.. I certainly don't know. One can always lose to another, it doesn't mean the tech. is inferior. I think most teachers teach as they often are too old to compete & would lose. Some keep sharp by sparring or ring fighting; if either 1 of them haven't been doing that, it's no surprise they would lose control.
I doubt that story -- although if Boztepe being some pervert wouldn't surprise me THAT much given his extremely fraudulent, bullshitting nature.
To say that no art or techniques could be inferior is demonstrably false. If I had a style that taught you to fight with your hands behind your head, would you think that me losing had nothing to do with my style?
Boztepe and Cheung looked like fools because their "training" consists of the same shit in this video: patty cake and compliant partners.
yes, behind your head, but if you truly study the techniques in WC they DO make sense in every way, the problem is that the average person is working to develop their timing and speed in the ring; something they will never do unless they fight regularly. Master Keith Mazza is 1 person who grew up using WC in the streets of NY & he competed many years ago, so he was one who can use his techniques for the fight. Most schools seem to be geared toward weekend warriors
No, no, no. I don't think so. You can't say styles don't matter in one breath and then say, "WC makes sense." Your contention is that if a fighter loses, it's always his own fault, not the style in which he trained. Now you're backpedalling and saying WC makes sense. You can't have it both ways. You can't say, "It's the fighter, not the style," while also saying that WC is effective. I brought up that made-up style to illustrate the point this.
Spot on, WingThai. This fucking wannabe-badass fraud knows the minute he steps into the ring his income will take a hit. He won't be able to sell his mystique to credulous ignoramuses as much. (I say as much because most MA con men, no matter how badly they are exposed, always will have loyal, faithful followers.) Money is and isn't the issue. He WOULD fight for money if he could 'cause he's such a camera whore and does his seminar bullshit, but he can't fight so that's that.
It seems possible that self defense tech for self protection is different than ring fighting.I can understand being really good @ defending oneself, but this does not nec transfer into a great ring or street fighter.I don't see how Boz can be great, despite his yrs in the art, if he isn't use to fight'g on a reg basis&I don't think he's a bar room brawler.Were I him,I'd let people know that I'm entering a realm I'm not accustomed to&I will gain experience so I learn how to bring WC to the ring.
Ring fighting incorporates most of the same things that apply to street fighting and vice versa: proper position, balance, foot work, accurate strikes, etc. They're not worlds and worlds apart as some people claim. I know people who fight in the ring and they don't have much trouble beating the shit out of people in bars.
Besides, if Cheung and Boztepe teach self-defense, then why did neither of them use any of these supposed techniques they teach, in that fight? Think about it.
When I speak of self defense, I am referring to the unexpected attack on the street that often occurs by those who are not MMA fighters or the like. Most people who mug people aren't getting into a fighting posture to fight someone, they are the ones lunging in to steal something and the self defense techniques are incorporated. In any even, I agree that people should be able to use the fighting tech in the ring, if you don't, you won't be much of a street fighter.
If you get ambushed then you get ambushed. MMA training is definitely applicable to this as much as any other system. It's not like because they didn't have a chance to get their mouthpiece, gloves, cup, 10 minute warm-up, vaseline on their face and notice from a ref to start fighting, that they can't fight off someone ambushing them in the street if the circumstances allow for it.
I agree with you, however, there is a difference between self defense & using your fighting skills in the streets. The MT school I went to even related a difference between self defense and fighting. Google Daddis Fight Camps in Philadelphia, Pa.. There are specific tactics to deal w/weapons, etc.. Your fighting skills might be enough, but then again, they might not be.
Self-defense is using fighting skills to defend yourself. You're either playing semantics or, at best, splitting hairs. Either way, your point about styles not mattering at all is 100% flawed.
I said I agree with you in that if someone teaches you to do something counterproductive. What I am also saying is that if you examined WC techniques, you can see where the techniques are often quite excellent, there just isn't a lot of people use to applying it on a regular basis in a real life setting. MA's in the states is not used like it was used when people did nothing else but MA as their life-style. Also, I believe combining non-conflicting arts is best (JJ w/MT for example)
There was never a time where people did nothing but MA unless they were either teaching or competing professionally or for a national team. If they did JUST train then how did they earn a living? No one pays you to just train in your dojo or whatever.
No, I don't see any "excellence" in most WC techniques. Their striking is weak, their defense is nonexistent and their training methods are a joke.
I can see Y U would say that based on what U visualize on youtube videos. However, I would wager $ that if U met Master Keith Maza, & U just C what he personally does w/ WC, U would change your mind, certainly, don't take my word for it.He was a NY street fighter, he made use of WC , however, he's may be too old now for MMA (my assumption).In early days of the MMA they were promotg BJJ, he has original application, they never let he & his school in.You can discuss this w/him to verify.
Unless Keith Maza has credible, verifiable wins on his record or a video of his badass WC skills, I couldn't give two shits about another fabled street fighter story. Boztepe claimed he was a badass street fighter who had no official fight record or even a video to back any of this up but he was proven to be full of shit when put to the test. I'm not going to go out of my way to meet any WC "master" who can actually "fight". Real fighters make their credibility obvious.
I agree that people need to put up or shut up. What I was getting @ was for U 2 examine techniques & see how it is used personally, as someone who is really into MMA would be able to C for themselves their potential value. 4 example,some1 tries to strike U w/their right; simple hand tap w/out chasing hands makes sense, however, the other arm is already raised guarding you if the other hand comes in, you can either strike w/that hand or it can defend another strike, & it's already there.
My point is that some things you don't need to be proven, they are rather obvious if you examine it yourself. That doesn't mean the person is going to win an MMA fight, as if he doesn't train for this, he'll have little to no possibility of winning.
I don't need to try out shitty techniques to know they're shitty. This deluded Boztepe and his fraudulent "grappling" system is total bullshit. Many of the things he does defy basic grappling concepts which have proven effective over many years.
WC doesn't use the kind of blocks you were describing. They fish for the attack with ridiculous "trapping" attempts. Hell, they don't even tuck their chin when they fight.
Firstly, I can't comment on Boztepe's techniques, I don't use them. I did WC for a few years, then I did Muay Thai and I just now returned to Muay Thai, but I live in an area where I can only attend MT 1 day per wk & bjj 1 day per week. The WC tech I was describing is via Keith Mazza. What I'm saying is that you can visualize for yourself the techniques & see for yourself it's applicability. You don't need to see an MMA fighter use it to c the obvious benefit to it. Its pretty straight forward.
DrT, you're still full of shit even now. When are you gonna grow up? Boztepe has no problem slapping his lackeys around for money. Why would he have a problem accepting money for a real fight?
There's not one thing in this entire video that's banned in MMA. You WC idiots always make that excuse but it's WC that doesn't allow for a lot of MMA techniques. Double leg takedowns and kicks to the head are just a couple of examples.
By the way, you are one ugly motherfucker, hahaha!
Why would we injury or kill each other in class? Again, your arguments are not very well thought out.
"There's not one thing in this entire video that's banned in MMA."... except that we no gloves on and no cups, or mouth guards, which are requires in MMA. So again, that is atleast "one thing" that is banned, showing you fail at being an asshole.
The classic WC paradox: "We know how to do very harmful and even deadly moves in a real fight, but we don't practice them on each other for safety reasons." How the hell do you figure you can do something you never practice? Hitting air isn't the same as hitting a moving target that's trying to hurt you back. Please, Boztepe was already in a real life fight that we've seen, and he looked like a fish out of water. In fact, he didn't even do any of the bullshit he shows off in his videos.
A fight from 1984? Please show us a video of YOURSELF from 1984 so we can judge you on that, and ignore the last 25 years of progress.
Kommisar, you border on saying some truth, so I leave you on here, but please get this correct. I do not ever use the "to deadly to spar" BS. I spar, EBMAS spars, so that line won't work.
Sparring is restricted for safety, just like sport MMA is. We are just not interested in changing our rules for training to come over and try out MMA training.
Oh, please, Boztepe didn't suddenly become a badass over the last 25 years seeing as how that was his last fight. He was already supposedly a WC expert at the time. Where was his WC? We didn't see ANY of it. Two WC masters go at it and neither one of them looks anything like a real fighter. The perfect demonstration for why WC is bullshit.
Haha, Boztepe didn't offer to fight the Gracies. He talked shit and then when he was challenged he found an excuse to back out. The guy is a joke.
again, kommi, don't talk about what you don't know.
Boztepe agreed to fight and would bring five fighters, instead Gracies offered him a UFC slot, which required you to pay damages to opponents, no killing, and no eye gouging or bitting. They offered him a "neutral" slot at the police academy where this fight would be a crime, and then the Gracies refused a true neutral spot at a magazine studio. Gracies wanted to control the MONEY from the video of the event and to PROMOTE their UFC show.
Boztepe would never agree to eye gouging or biting. Did you see the way he "grappled" Cheung? Imagine Royce controlling him with those allowed in place. You're a fucking fool if you think ANYONE in their right mind would turn down a fight because it didn't allow those bitch moves. Boztepe has bragged how his system can beat grapplers and he never shows these "techniques", so obviously his system supposedly can beat a Gracie without bites or eye gouges, you fucking moron.
Unless Boz got better since attacking Cheung, there is no way he could grapple with gracies. I have to ask Boz's students if they ever see him actually spar or fight real fights in at least the ring on a regular basis. There's no way he can win without such continual practice.
You don't grapple but I will tell you that Boztepe's "anti-grappling" skills that he's shown in other videos is horrible. Even a white belt could get pass Boztepe's stupid little leg maneuvers (pass his guard). He talks about how good this shit is against grapplers, and guess whom he uses to demonstrate this? That's right, one of his students, who has no background in grappling either. Why doesn't he show his shit works ON AN ACTUAL GRAPPLER? Because it wouldn't work. He's a fraud.
Unsanctioned fights are a crime no matter where you hold them, so your point about the police academy is completely moot.
Yes, the Gracies wanted to put Boztepe on TV where he'd be humiliated. How telling that Boztepe has no problem filming himself teach his bullshit time and time again, yet refuses to fight on national TV despite bragging about his alleged street fighting background and "anti-grappling" techniques. You'd think he'd be at home in a UFC fight!
I think Boz's followers understand, or should understand, that no matter who the person is or how great they are at what they do, they can't enter an unfamiliar environment & expect to do well. He would have to practice for quite some time in the ring 1st, fight many others 1st, get use to the environment & then give it a go while understanding there's no shame in defeat as the best of the best have been defeated & they get back up and fight again.
He should have all that practicing out of the way if he were so capable of competing in NHB. The only thing he'd really have to get used to would be the cage, but then again:
1. WC is supposedly tailor-made for close quarter fighting.
2. There weren't many against-the-cage techniques back when Royce was competing in the UFC, like pinning someone against it or using it to get off the ground. Those didn't come till later.
Since I experienced WC, I feel it does have extremely useful technqs, but such techniques don't mean anyth'g if your'e not use to the 'fight.' As I said before, schools promoting MMA invariable include bjj&MT.WC schools don't advertise as MMA. People who want to fight naturally go to what they see as MMA. Many who are just there for self defense & a hobby r more likely to go into WC unfortunately. In any art, U need the ones who want to fight, in order to get 'fighter types' for the MMA.
Actually, a lot of people do MMA for hobby, fitness and self-defense and have no aspirations to compete.
"Being used to 'the fight'" is nothing more than being used to fighting a fully resisting opponent, which is exactly what is done in MMA and what you almost never see in WC, and certainly never see with Boztepe.
NO, he agreed but all proceeds after training expenses had to go to a charity, Gracies refuse as they wanted the PROFIT for their pocket.
A magazine publisher offered their studio, true no rules event, and Gracies refused. I give them the benefit of the doubt that they wanted the money from the video, but maybe they where scared to lose an eye while trying to choke him out.
UFC rules prevent anti-grap due to the restrictions around kicking downed opponents and striking the neck with elbows.
It seems all of Boztepe's reasons for refusing the fight are fucking pathetic: it wouldn't be a charity fight, it would happen on TV, he wouldn't be allowed to use techniques which he doesn't even train, etc.
Yes, the Gracies were invested in the UFC. It cost THEM money to put on the fight, dumbass. Haha, this is hilarious. You're actually criticizing the Gracies for not giving their money away. You're an idiot. You look like one too in the video.
Are you fucking kidding me? OK, now it's 100% clear you're lying just to defend your pussy teacher. UFC rules at the time were vale tudo rules: no eye gouges, no biting and no groin strikes, and the last one was repealed after the first or second event. The rules about kicking the heads of a downed opponent and all that didn't come till much later after the Gracies left the UFC.
Besides, you once again IGNORE the point that BOZTEPE DOESN'T DO ANY OF THOSE THINGS (EYE GOUGES, ETC.)!
What's going on at 2:50?
STIQS 1 week ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Emin Boztepe is simply awsome. I can imagine him destroying most strikers in the ufc.
And that MORON of joe fuckbrain rogan says Wing Chun does not work.
Wing Chun is totally AWSOME so effective no wasted motion.
777ELDEMONIO 4 months ago
@mmabl wing chun is not shit only your uninformed ignorant comments are
58dragonmist 4 months ago
put a shirt on you clown
58dragonmist 4 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
?.....he is a chicken, i remember the days in holland during a seminar and some well known MMA guys wanted to fight him, and he chickened out!! i was THERE. a seminar with the Dutch sifu from holland... I trained 3 years under emin & came to realise he is a fake heroe. he claims (700!!????)streetfights and won without a scratch. i was a bouncer and never ever you can come to 700 fights!! only when your crazy!! liar!
MrCalathea 5 months ago
lol there is a comment missing by me so the laughter of minasz makes no sense. He laughed because I said my WT Sifu was a MT teacher for 15 years before sticking complete to WT. And yes it is true. Maybe I removed the comment in accident. but who cares Dr Zeus seems like a great guy. So I stop spamming now.
jomushin7 8 months ago
@jomushin7 as you can see, I let comments stay, no matter what fools say. I haven't deleted anything unless it had extremely vulgar language.
as to Thai Boxing etc.. WT people have been open to sparring folks for along time....many videos's of it, several MMA champs in Europe, etc... People are fighters, not styles.......and EVERYBODY SUCKS.....so go train.
DrTzeus 8 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@minasz so and why was my teacher 15 years muay thai teacher before he completely moved to WT and always said Emin is a sick badass? And how do you know that I didn't train MT in my youth?
jomushin7 8 months ago
I wanna see him spar with a thai boxer...
minasz 8 months ago
@minasz lol and why? Go to his schools maybe you will find some thaiboxer there too.
jomushin7 8 months ago
@jomushin7 Cuz I think he s fake doing useless chi sao against nobodies!! A thaiboxer or a good boxer would knock him out.
minasz 8 months ago
Comment removed
jomushin7 8 months ago
@jomushin7 whahahaha
minasz 8 months ago
@minasz whatever. I think you didn't train any MTB or anything other. I trained a lot of Martial arts. Not MT but also boxing and kickboxing and a lot of other stuff in my youth. You seem just like a silly MMA fanboy who never trained anything. So who cares.
jomushin7 8 months ago
@jomushin7 I train 22 years Martial Arts. I did Kyokushin (brown belt), Muay Thai, Jiu Jiutsu and now I train and teach JKD.
minasz 8 months ago
@minasz I like JKD very much and pfs and stuff. :D Have fun bro
jomushin7 8 months ago
haha how did you manage to get emin in your backyard! I would love to train with him as well:)
TheDrCritic 11 months ago
Emin has good wing chun, but not my respect. He looks like a punk ass kid showing off. Anywho, come check out my iron fist anyone who lives in New South Wales.. message me for contact and meet.
vigiyoung 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@vigiyoung and your comments show you are the same
58dragonmist 4 months ago
@silicon605 Wing Tzun is about training hard and developping skills,senses and soul combined.
silicon605 does your words sound like some true martial artists critics?
If you criticisize somebody by his/her character is one thing, but if you do that by his work or art is another thing.
Please decide which one do you want to do? I can't answer for my Sifu about his character but I can answer for his style or art. And I am trusting in his skills.
Well do you really trust in your skills?
I do...
Achilles1987 1 year ago
@silicon605 I am training in EBMAS Wing Tzun for years. Now if you critisize Sifu Emin Boztepe you should have same knowledge as he does...
Okay. I assume you do. I believe Sifu Fred Kwok is a great person and martial artist.
But I ask you silicon605 have you watched Sifu Emin's other videos? Besides have you ever seen him in action or in seminar? Have you practiced chi sau with him? Well... He is very fast and his senses are amazing. I can say this because I trained with many sifus.
Achilles1987 1 year ago
The ego has landed
otleybull 1 year ago
@silicon605 Good grief, why so harsh man? Cant the man have a bit of fun on camera? BTW, if you think his wing chun is no good, why don't you take one of his classes? Or challenge one of his students to a friendly sparring match? Just a thought.
Peace :)
samuski36 1 year ago
Anyone know the name of the music in this video/ Thanks
se7enskies 2 years ago
@se7enskies
TiestoDreams-Adagio_For_Strings_(Energy_Rmx).mp3
DrTzeus 2 years ago
Comment removed
ebmasdan92 2 years ago
You dont know what you are speaking about, That is the problem with learning you westerners anything you create dogmas based on your own bealives. Wingchun have nothing to do with your ebalives it is principles of couse and effect yin yang in action as meditation in movment.
BushLieWorldDie 2 years ago
What may have been a great gain to the Wing Chun (Ving Tsun, Wing Tzun, Bum Chum OR however you spell it) world...
... was sadly an even bigger loss to the Turkish Kebab world.
Emin knew how to make a Yaprak Doner that could bring a warmth in your heart & a tear to your eye, even without any Chilli sauce.
DippShits 2 years ago
I was going say something here but your ventriloquist joke on your own comments page cracked me up so never mind.
See that Kommi, he may talk shit on other people's pages, but at least he has the balls to leave his own comment page open.
DrTzeus 2 years ago
@DrTzeus Feel free to make any comments, if they are funny and directed at me I approve them up anyway!
DippShits 2 years ago
do ye reckon ye posted dat on enough videos yet nearly everyone has dat comment
ebmasdan92 2 years ago
Maybe...
...What is the Kebab situation like in Ireland?
I know you guys are covered on the alcohol front, I just wonder what the post-pub snack would be like.
As far as I am concerned a night on the lash without a Kebab to finish it is like a diseased potato.
DippShits 2 years ago
boztepe ='s fail
is a hasbeen that never was
wasnt his biggest claim to fame appearin in some shit movie wiht cythia rothrock lol
every clip i watched of emin fail is the same smaller opponents sloppy technique... he has shown the world nothing new about wing chun...he isnt even part of the true wing chun lineage...thats why that branch of wing chun changed to ving tsun....means reject's of wing chun...lmfao...soo true....dr zeus you talk total shite also.
WUHELLRAZOR 2 years ago
@WUHELLRAZOR
um, no. So you fail at Cynthia Rothrock.....
um, Wing Tsun is NOT Ving Tsun, so you fail again.
Actually, Ving Tsun was first and Wing Chun is the wrong spelling so you really fail, quite badly.
"Shite" is spelled SHIT, so if you wish to continue failing please use a browser with a spell checker.
and EBMASdan92, my patience with these fools is waining.......
DrTzeus 2 years ago
@WUHELLRAZOR when you fall in life, and start to spit hate on a free video site, do your homework, or you'll fail even at the web. small, or large, better WT knowledge will mess you up. some WT si-fu's are very small, have you seen their videos? guess not. also, you never had a chance to attend a WT class, right? lineage? what's that, like underwear? he OWNS his own sport. either you fail again, or his thousands of hands on students know LESS than you are. which one is it?
mrlixalot 1 year ago
@WUHELLRAZOR made le lol
VixtoryQ 1 year ago
@DippShits he'd offer you "YAPRAK Doner", want some? Make sure it's not "YARRAK Doner" though. May taste different.
mrlixalot 1 year ago
@mrlixalot Ha Ha! Good one.
DippShits 1 year ago
Damn this guy Kommisar outta get another hobby or a girlfriend or something
BringerOfTheTruth 2 years ago
@BringerOfTheTruth ye i know he is a fag haha
ebmasdan92 2 years ago
luv d way kommisar knows everything bou martial arts but yet havnt seen him got d balls 2 challenge sifu or 2 upload vids of him.....
ebmasdan92 2 years ago
Sounds to me like kommisar knows what he's talking about. I've noticed also that he is very careful to be respectful to WC, he's just disdainful of some of its practitioners. Speaking of balls, has your sifu ever stepped into the octagon?
varanid9 2 years ago
kommisar has commented on almost every wing tzun chun video on utube sayin how its a crap useless martial art...d fag has nutin better 2 do but badmouth sifu emin......get his dates of his seminars and go and prove d "fraud" he is.......as i sed before i cud use a gud laugh...seriously wit all ur expertise in the martial arts beatin sifu shud b no proablem 2 any of u.....EBMAS 4 LIFE
ebmasdan92 2 years ago
Well, I have noticed that BJJ has as many shit-talkers as any other MA.
varanid9 2 years ago
Why would he? Most of the WT techniques are against the rules in UFC? A better question would be if any WT people are fighting with a modified WT in Cage contests.
DrTzeus 2 years ago
Again, you lie. There's nothing here that's not allowed under unified MMA rules -- not ONE thing. I love this bullshit about "rules" you LARPers always make, as if if WC can't hit the guy in the balls or eyes it's completely useless. Even then, we never see a chunner do any of this shit. You fags barely even spar if at all. This video is a perfect testament to that.
Yeah, imagine that: you chunners would have to "modify" your crappy art so that it actually works. Hahaha!
kommisar 2 years ago
We don't video sparing, so to you it doesn't exist? Well then YOU don't exist since you have uploaded NOTHING!!!
Go away you are repeating yourself.
DrTzeus 2 years ago
You don't video sparring because it looks nothing like any of the "techniques" you brag about doing or show in the video. I've seen plenty of WC fights or sparring matches and never once have I seen any of your "street" moves or even your silly trapping; doesn't exist. It merely exists in your fantasy-addled, deluded minds and faggotty play acting. You can show Boztepe flexing his biceps and yet you can't show any of your "eye gouges". Telling....
kommisar 2 years ago
WT doesn't do "Trapping" that is JKD and WC. Anyway, as I said previous, I see many MMA training tools that they do not do in the ring, such as hitting tires, pulling elastic ropes, grappling with no striking, striking with no grappling, focus mitt work, etc....So training does not make for one to one transitions to fighting.
further more, modern personal training involves numerous development exercises for sports that look nothing like the sport. Sorry you are not able make this connection
DrTzeus 2 years ago
Horseshit. Your silly patty cake routine in the video says otherwise. Boztpe even says he trains trapping.
Those MMA "tools" are conditioning and training to isolate certain skills. Even when they grapple with no striking, it still becomes integrated in their fighting when they get into the ring, unlike WC nonsense. You haven't fought a day in your life. Go study dancing or something; fighting isn't for you.
kommisar 2 years ago
Well, my understanding is that this Boztepe also studied Judo or BJJ.
varanid9 2 years ago
That is true about judo groundfighting being what BJJ was based on, apparently, as I've read practitioners of both BJJ and Judo refer to it.
However, I've never heard of any of the Gracies walk into someone else's school and attack them, or ever seen them trying to impress students with their physique.
varanid9 2 years ago
You refer to the Cheung/Boztepe fight? William Cheung had an open challenge to fight "anyone anytime", but avoided all takers. He then would claim that no one would except his challenge. WT people tried to arrange a fight but Cheung claimed it could only be with those of his "seniority", of which there was no one, since Leung Ting, the founder of WT was under his age in seniority. Boztepe merely attended a Cheung seminar and then waited for him to announce his open challenge, and took it.
DrTzeus 2 years ago
I've stated repeatedly in the past that I too agree that Cheung is a fraud, a pussy and a douchebag, and he still is. You don't need to beat a dead horse. The point is Boztepe had the upper hand on Cheung as Cheung was smaller, older and was sucker attacked. Neither fighter used any "WC" in that fight as it looked like a typical playground fight. Seriously, tell us that is the mark of a WC expert. Please point to us the "WC techniques" Boztepe used in that embarrassing scuffle.
kommisar 2 years ago
Boztepe today is older then Cheung was then, yet people still expect him to go into the cage, so that "old man" BS won't fly here. I could point to several things but I do agree it was a sloppy fight and it is a shitty video.
DrTzeus 2 years ago
Randy Couture is Boztepe's age and Renzo Gracie is only 5 years younger. Hell, Tank Abbott is 44 and he has horrible conditioning, yet all those guys still fight. Boztepe has no excuse; he's never proven his bullshit works in a real fight against a live opponent. His patty cake and rehearsed routines only impress credophiles like you.
Go on, point to one thing "WC" in that video. You still haven't I noticed. I thought your WC was meant "for the street".
kommisar 2 years ago
No one stated BJJ and judo are worlds apart. Helio and Carlson Gracie merely modified the JJ Carlson was taught by Maeda. They didn't reinvent the wheel. There has been much documentation on this that there's not much to discuss about it.
Yes, the Gracies challenged other people to fights and then video taped them. Boztepe did that ONE time, and as soon as his Cheung blew him off he hit him from behind and threw his years of WC training out the windo. Boztepe is an asshole and a fraud.
kommisar 2 years ago
actually Cheung claims he kicked Emin first, and it was edited out of the video, but you go ahead and repeat 25 year old gossip.
DrTzeus 2 years ago
Mmm, no, Cheung actually claims Boztepe attacked him while his back was turned. Either way, Boztepe looked like a fucking puss. We definitely didn't see any of that stuff that's "against UFC rules". Why is that? Where are all the "illegal" techniques you WC bozos so proudly brag of? Seems like a bunch of LARPing since you never seem to actually do it.
kommisar 2 years ago
Wrong. The gossip whores repeat that, but his statement talks about a kick to Boztepes knee and how the slippers and floor caused him (Cheung) to slide away backwards.
Prove me wrong with a source.
DrTzeus 2 years ago
I really don't care to look into it. Boztepe had the upper hand no matter how you slice it: he came ready to fight and was bigger, stronger and faster than Cheung. He even had him on the ground in a very dominant position and did nothing. Both douchebags are frauds who showed the reality of their so-called "fighting skills". Why didn't Boztepe take out Cheung with an eye gouge or something like that that you LARPers claim you do all the time?
kommisar 2 years ago
Please site where I hide behind the "eye poke" excuse. You can't because I never have.
DrTzeus 2 years ago
"Eye poke" was just one example, which is why I followed it with "etc.". You WC clowns are always saying the rules prevent your "techniques" from working in full-contact competitions, including NHB. Here's a silly statement of yours:
"UFC rules prevent anti-grap due to the restrictions around kicking downed opponents and striking the neck with elbows."
So in other words you guys elbow each other in the neck and kick each other in the head while on the ground? Please show that in your video.
kommisar 2 years ago
kommisar u r a fukin idiot....first of as regards 2 boztepe "copying" bjj into his martial art and sayin he robbed it is like sayin bruce lee was a thief wen he made jeet kune do....dere is not a wing tzun/chun/tsun vid on utube dat u havnt commented on...i can only guess from dis dat u r sad and have no life
ebmasdan92 2 years ago
No, they're not the same, you stupefied fucktard. Bruce actually credits the arts where he took the techniques from to incorporate into his system. Boztepe actually says that's a part of WC and always has been. The difference is me saying I quoted someone vs. quoting them and then saying I came up with that passage. You're a gullible, uneducated, LARPing retard who lacks any solid education. Go back to your anime, you dipshit.
kommisar 2 years ago
boztepe's a faggott...his fighting techiniques are all out of co~ordination and his instruction is poor....hes all about the muscles and clearly has limited skill/techinuque. my granny could beat this fool.
WUHELLRAZOR 2 years ago
I bet your Grannie can upload video too, unlike you jerky. I'm deleting your other rude comments.....
DrTzeus 2 years ago
I removed your rude and graphic sexual comments and ebmasdan92s replies. Wuellbarrow you can talk all the trash you want but keep it clean, children read this stuff.
DrTzeus 2 years ago
dr tzeus are u on facebook ? message me wit ur name if so tanx :))
ebmasdan92 2 years ago
I'm curious as i study wing tsun, how does EBMAS differ from wing tsun?
bebo3ful 2 years ago
I am not sure now as the Europeans duplicated a lot of our changes. EBMAS had a more comprehensive single arm program, gives more sooner, and has more Latosa Escrima mixed in if you like.
example; WT single arm only had the basic 3 pairs and kwan sau with step, EBMAS has single arm sets all the way up to 8th student grade matching all the root moves needed into 2nd tech.
but really we still respect the heart of Leung Ting Wing Tsun. To paraphrase, "The Ting is dead, long live the King!"
DrTzeus 2 years ago
yes reason is lost on most of them.....that's why I always .....shut up and sign a waiver....been a street fighter my entire life and I'm Irish-American Indian....busting heads is in my blood....lolto bad so many are more concerned about trophies and less about training for real :-((
CRIPPLE35 2 years ago
Greetings dr tzeus i am student of ebmas and here ur wasting ur time wit dese fags who type shit bou boztepe.....if he is so shit and dere so great let dem fight boztepe and beat em in front of a camera....u can find d dates on d ebmas page.....
ebmasdan92 2 years ago
Well, it is a waste, but if someone doesn't provide the real story, then these gossip whores are all that gets heard. We were very secretive about stuff in the past so now outside of Europe, more people have only heard the lies from these knuckle heads.
Especially that Sifu Emin backed out of the Gracie Challange. I was a student of his back then and I watched the whole thing unfold, as well as doing research on it for the last ten years. It is very clear that the Gracies backed out, not Emin.
DrTzeus 2 years ago
well i only joined ebmas in january(i train in ireland) so am not sure on d gracies fight.....regardless of who baked out of d fite emin or d gracies wat dese steroid pumpin fools need 2 realise is dat ebmas wing tzun is for STREET self defence....if i wanted 2 fite an mma fighter i wud take up mma....i want 2 know how to defend myself effectivly so i do ebmas wing tzun.....i am not sayin mma wont defend u on d streets but ebmas wing tzun does it 4 me....
1 2 3 EBMAS :)
ebmasdan92 2 years ago
Ya, I agree. Si-fu says for most to ignore the internet stuff as it has lead to several challenge events. It's just words and we shouldn't fight over words, only to defend our lives. He doesn't even read this stuff because it gets him upset. He ask me years ago to continue defending our honor in the internet forums so we have at least one voice of reason out here.
To bad reason is lost on most of these fools....
DrTzeus 2 years ago
indeed i can understand how shit heads like dis wud upset sifu.....jus wonderin how long are u training in wing tzun?
ebmasdan92 2 years ago
Still supporting the lies of your fraudulent "sifu" I see. Well, you've been a credulous idiot who lives in fantasy this long so you're most likely beyond hope by now.
The letter exchange between the Gracies' side and Boztepe is on line for anyone to view. The Gracies offered several times to pay for Boztepe's expenses to fight in the UFC and he refused. He's a pussy and his fight with Cheung is positive proof of such. You're a LARPing, credulous jackass -- the perfect Bzotepe student.
kommisar 2 years ago
Welcome back, I see things haven't changed.
Neither the Graces nor Boztepe could find a way to make that fight happen. Why do you put all the blame on Boztepe? Because he didn't want to fight on PayPerView? It was the Gracie Camp that refused the last neutral location at a magazine publisher studio, not Emin, yet you and everyone else blame Emin for it? At the very least you must admit that NEITHER party let it happen, not blame it all on Boztepe.
DrTzeus 2 years ago
Hmm, interesting that Boztepe has no problem going on talk shows, appearing on local TV news, starring in movies and putting up dozens of videos of his silly WC techniques, and yet he has a huge problem doing the one thing he claims he can do very well, on TV: fight. He has no problem bragging about all his other, past fights but as soon as he has to do one which people can actually watch, he finds a way to cower out. Typical LARPing fraud behavior right there. He's a loser and so are you.
kommisar 2 years ago
In each of your televised examples he is NOT HURTING PEOPLE ON PURPOSE. Further more the Gracies REFUSED a venue that did not allow them to make money off of the fight film. So this is the difference, that Horion wanted to make money off peoples pain and injury and Boztepe did not.
You just don't get it do you? Anything else?
Anything more current, like how even Horion Gracie walked away from UFC because it has to many restrictions, yet you STILL expect Emin to go fight in it.
DrTzeus 2 years ago
Boztepe brags about his "300 bare knuckle street fights" as a way of marketing himself and his teachings but he has a problem with prize fighting? That makes zero fucking sense and only a credulous buffoon like you would buy into that bullshit.
Boztepe would get killed in the UFC now, even with the added rules. That being said, yes, it would be VERY nice if he went in there for a fight.
Face it, the man is a cheap fraud and you're a fucking patsy.
kommisar 2 years ago
Thats it, the "300 fights thing". You realize those were all before the William Cheung thing, so in the 1970's and early 1980's, and that he stopped fighting after that as people called him a "thug" for it.
o, maybe you don't realize that people can change, and that SOME people may not ENJOY fighting......but thats not fraud, unless you can prove he didn't have those fights. Seems that would have been done by now if it could be eh?
DrTzeus 2 years ago
If he's ashamed of his former "thug" life, he should not be bragging about it in order to boost his credibility. Then again, the man is arrogant beyond compare. Just the way he mugs for the camera, beats up his stupefied, compliant students with a smile and basically acts like the asshole he is testifies to this.
Anyway, the "300 street fight" claim is bogus. No scars, no losses, no record of any kind? Only a credulous idiot would swallow that bullshit, which explains why you believe it.
kommisar 2 years ago
Helio also claimed he "never lost", even though he did.
Sifu Emin has several knife and bullet scars, but again, you prove you are just making it up as you go and that you have no knowledge of this subject except the gossip you and your whores whisper into each others ears.....
Further more, I haven't heard him talk about his past accept to say he has the experience. It is that other Martial Art system that uses fighting in a cage to sell contracts about self defense.
DrTzeus 2 years ago
several knife a bullet scars....where do u see dat happen? the streets not in a cage match
dus street= no holes bared fight(ebmas wing tzun style)
cage match=sport(mma)
i dont need 2 explain dis 2 u dr tzeus jus dese idiots
ebmasdan92 2 years ago
Bullshit. Helio never said such thing. You're getting very desperate here, making up shit out of thin air.
And those bullet and knife scars prove only that he was wounded by those things, not that he won a bunch of street fights involving them. It's really simple: your "sifu" proves his system works against resisting opponents, not his idiots, credulous, stupefied and compliant students. He either does this or he doesn't; there is no gray areas or in-between's.
kommisar 2 years ago
eh? You asked about scars as proof. He has scars.....my Si-Fu proved it all back in the 1970's and early 1980's.
Now you need to upload video of ourself or you run the risk of being seen as just another mouth boxing keyboard warrior.
DrTzeus 2 years ago
He didn't prove shit as evidenced by that horrible fight with Cheung. He's a fraud whose only recorded fight showed he sucks ass.
You can talk mock me for my lack of videos all you want; it's your "sifu" who is the one claiming to be a badass and charging money for lessons; the burden of proof rests on him.
"So is BJJ a sport? Then it is Judo."
You were making a sports reference, asshole. That's why I brought up the rules. You evidently can't form a logical argument.
kommisar 2 years ago
You are welcome to go see him for yourself. Only way to be sure.
DrTzeus 2 years ago
Please elaborate on what you mean by "fraudulent". This is a very serious charge and one would expect some substantial proof of this. So far all you have done here is repeat old gossip and rumors or express half of the story as an opinion.
I am waiting......
DrTzeus 2 years ago
His "anti-grappling" program for one. He claims this is part of WC but really it's nothing but a watered-down version of BJJ he ripped off. His claim about his street fights is obviously bogus. He's not a fighter. Yup, sounds like a fraud to me.
kommisar 2 years ago
Actually he created it and it is taught in Wing Tsun so yes it is part of WT. Further more all of the movements in the Anti-grappling program are the same movements used in the regular standing program, just changed to fit the new geometry on the ground, so even if your claim in true, that it is from BJJ, it has been made to fit Wing Tsun using WT techniques and tactics.
BJJ ripped off Feldenkrais Judo anyway, get over it.....it is called progress.
DrTzeus 2 years ago
No, he didn't create it. He fucking ripped it off another system and then said it's part of WC. It's total plagiarism. The funny part though is that he sucks at it. Any decent BJJ fighter would pass Boztepe's pathetic "guard".
Wrong. BJJ is modified JJ. That's a known and very well documented fact, and I wouldn't bitch as much if your fraud "sifu" just manned up for once in his pathetic, cowardly life and admit he ripped off BJJ to capitalize on the BJJ boom.
kommisar 2 years ago
Really? JJ eh? So it is a fluke then that Feldenkrais "Higher Judo, Ground Fighting" book, 1952, is EXACTLY the same as original Gracie BJJ. You continue to prove you are ignorant and I would like you to stop writing graffiti on my wall, unless you have something new to say.
DrTzeus 2 years ago
Assuming what you're saying is true, it is actually since the Gracies developed their system long before that (although they may have been still perfecting it in the 50's). In fact, Helio Gracie was fighting in official vale tudo fights in the 30's.
Hmm, so it's alright for Boztepe to make a vague claim about how he "has experience" to sell his bullshit but the Gracies are wrong to sell their system by referring to actual examples of it being used? Nice job on showing us you're a retard.
kommisar 2 years ago
When did I say the Gracie system was wrong? Just because I argue against your bullshit claims towards Emins character does't create an inverse toward BJJ or Gracie JJ. Now Horion I think got his bluff called and he backed down from the fight with Emin in the end to save Royce from damage. Otherwise, WTF are you talking?
It was all JJ before Kano made it into Judo, a sport. So is BJJ a sport? Then it is Judo. It fits the Judo model exactly, just called JJ as another sales gimmic.
DrTzeus 2 years ago
What the hell are you babbling about, freak? You claimed BJJ was a rip-off of some other art and Helio denied he ever lost a fight. Both are categorically untrue and it comes as no surprised that upon being challenged for proof you try to change the subject. Typical WC behavior.
Boztepe wasn't interested in fighting Royce, so how the hell did Rorion save Royce, fucktard? Besides, Royce would have owned that sorry punk. Boztepe couldn't fight his way out of a baklava crust.
kommisar 2 years ago
It was claimed that BJJ was "undefeated" and thus the "Ultimate" at one point, even though Helio's team threw in the towel. Helio said, which I respect, that he would have died first and so was not defeated as a man, but his team through in the towel. Thus a Gracie loss.
Just to make sure here, are you saying you like the way Horion promoted BJJ?
and you can imagine who would have owned who, but we will never know.....
DrTzeus 2 years ago
How I like Rorion's promotion of his family's art has nothing to do with this. My only concern is you proving your ridiculous claims. You said Helio said he was never beaten and that BJJ is the same thing as judo. You have proven neither; you've only said incoherent nonsense as a sign of weakness and delusion. Perhaps you are in need of some professional mental help? Think about it.
kommisar 2 years ago
I have the "Higher Judo: Ground Work" book right here, and it is EXACTLY what I was taught in a Carlsen BJJ school and is almost exactly what I have here in a Machado BJJJ book. BJJ=judo ground fighting. Nothing wrong with that.
I can look for the Helio interview, but I would rather train......
DrTzeus 2 years ago
You don't know shit about BJJ. I know this because you claim Boztepe's "anti-grappling" bullshit works and is not a rip-off of BJJ. You can read least part of the book online. None of the illustrations even showed so much as a guard pass or a back mount escape. You're as full of shit as your fraud "sifu".
Bullshit. They had gis before judo. You're wrong again.
Helio's defeat to Kimura was published in a Brazilian newspaper -- and you're saying he denied this??? You're a fucking loser.
kommisar 2 years ago
again, you fail at reading. The interview I mentioned has Helio saying he was never defeated as a man, meaning spiritually. He didn't trough in the towel, his team did, so he can say this. He never gave up.
However, early UFC propaganda read that BJJ was undefeated. This was true in UFC but they worded it to sound like they had never ever been defeated.
DrTzeus 2 years ago
I'm not going to scroll back to your original imbecilic comment. You said Helio claimed he was never defeated, correct? You never mentioned anything about "spiritually" or whatever bullshit. My guess is you realized you were wrong and backpedalled. Wouldn't surprise me as you've shown you support fraud.
The quoted Wiki article is on the judogi. Gis are not all the same, fool. A judogi is different from a jiujitsugi for example. I referred to the gi as a whole, not the one for judo.
kommisar 2 years ago
2:50 Is that Emin having a piss on somebody's lawn in broad daylight?
DippShits 2 years ago
Hahaha. Wouldn't surprise me if it were.
Oh, that's not a lawn. It's a "martial arts school" or "gym" as stated in the video title. ^_^
kommisar 2 years ago
That would be funny if someone hadn't already said it over a year ago.....
He is breaking up bread crumbs to feed my fish in the pond.
DrTzeus 2 years ago
@DrTzeus Thank you for clarifying.
I figured it unlikely Emin would do such a thing. It just looked like he COULD be urinating, which was why I asked.
DippShits 2 years ago
from Wiki,
" Jigoro Kano derived the original judogi from the kimono and other Japanese garments around the turn of the 20th century, and as such the judogi was the first modern martial arts training uniform."
so, who is wrong again? They were tearing apart each others jackets so they modified thick firemens kimonos.
DrTzeus 2 years ago
Wrong again, douchetard. Judo's rules and skill set are different from BJJ, so are its approaches to fighting. For example, in BJJ if you are thrown on your back you don't automatically lose the fight as in judo. Likewise, judo doesn't allow for stalls nearly as much as BJJ as the fighters are stood up very quickly. The judo then differed from the judo today and was based more on traditional JJ. You again show your appalling ignorance and delusion. Get help, you tool.
kommisar 2 years ago
What? Don't try to get all technical with sport rules here. I am talking about techniques, not rules which let the ref stop the fight for you....bitch.
But as you say, Judo is based on JJ, as is BJJ. Tell me, which style was it that introduced the Gi to the sport? ....and thus you see that in fact JUDO is the root of BJJ.
DrTzeus 2 years ago
They use gis even in traditiona JJ, dumbass. Besides, that's irrelevant; you made the statement that BJJ = judo, not that judo is its root. Again, the credulous WC retard fucks up and makes a dumbass argument.
"It"? So you're saying "it" made the claim? Again, your lack of intelligence makes itself known. You said before that Helio claimed he never loss. You still haven't proven this. Your rhetoric is very poor, as are you fighting skills.
kommisar 2 years ago
The Gi was introduced for use in Judo.
I saw Helio make the statement in an interview, I heard it pronounced often in the early UFC days. I still here it about Royces "White Out" event since they through in the towel before the action started in that round, but sports wise it was still a loss.
You still haven't "proven" my Sifu is an Asshole or a fraud either.
DrTzeus 2 years ago
@DrTzeus dr tzeus please delete d comments from kommisar i have seen him on every vid on utube for wing chun/tsun/tzun and its always d same shite he says....im afraid u jus cant get through 2 an idiot like dat
ebmasdan92 2 years ago
I don't delete much, except Turk Hate and overly graphic sexual rudeness. Idiots words are there to be judged for what they are worth.
DrTzeus 2 years ago
@kommisar NICE ONE DUDE, WE NEED PEOPLE LIKE YOU TO TELL THE TRUTH.
mysticpiggyx 1 year ago
Fuck yeah.
kommisar 1 year ago
@kommisar Where have you been I missed you? Atleast your neg comments make sense.
DrTzeus 1 year ago
sifu boztepe is a hero
ebmasdan92 2 years ago
Kommi blocked for a week, so he can have a high school Graduate help him figure this out.
I warned him not to use the Cheung fight as an example of Boztepes fighting skill currently, or even back under the UFC challenge days, but he really fails at reading comprehension.
If I am wrong someone let me know. I don't mind other opinions but he was not really meeting me half way.
DrTzeus 2 years ago
Here is a grappling style some in WC study as an adjunct to WC. Search for Chin Na Demo on you tube.
WingThaiJ 2 years ago
tae1c you can fuck off.....
DrTzeus 2 years ago
Why doesn't he try ufc?
WingThaiJ 2 years ago
Boztepe could change to focus on training for cage fights, but he would have to modify what techniques we use to fit the rules and then train them in the Wing Tzun way. But then he couldn't teach.
and it wouldn't be WT anymore so it wouldn't really prove anything except that he is a strong fighter. We all ready know that.....
also, he has an ethical issue with fighting for money. Hurting people for money, in a way of thinking about it, is the LAST career a Martial Artist should strive for.
DrTzeus 2 years ago
I love WC, but, I also realize unless someone knows what it's like to be hit&to hit in a competition, they R going 2 have less of a chance of overcoming adrenaline rush in midst of a real fight on streets.There's enough involved w/WCthat it can be used in ring. I personally think there might be a belief that if he loses, he might lose credibility & it could hurt him financially & possibly lose /respect. I'm not going to judge intentions, but it seems a cop out to say one won't fight for $
WingThaiJ 2 years ago
Even if he lost, I don't think it's a reason to lose face; it just means the other guy might be better at what he does or it could be luck, whoever got the best shot in; it's not necessarily a judgement of the art if one loses. LIke when Boztepe attacked GM Cheung (edited video),it doesn't change how good Cheungs art is, it might just have to do with him growing older in the art. Not too many older masters can beat their younger students in a fight, but they 'know' more & can teach the younger.
WingThaiJ 2 years ago
I disagree with this other comment of yours. He would lose face if he got his ass kicked. This bullshitter is always going on about how street-experienced he is, how he's had over 300 bare knuckle street fights, had to fight off bullies as a kid, etc. How's it going to look when an MMA practitioner of a few years makes him look like a joke?
Cheung was still practicing WC at the time of that fight, and despite his life-long practicing of it he didn't use it AT ALL in that fight. What a fraud
kommisar 2 years ago
I saw a post elsewhere by someone who claimed to be there & related Boz pulled his pants down to his ankles 1st & he related some other details, edited film, etc.. I certainly don't know. One can always lose to another, it doesn't mean the tech. is inferior. I think most teachers teach as they often are too old to compete & would lose. Some keep sharp by sparring or ring fighting; if either 1 of them haven't been doing that, it's no surprise they would lose control.
WingThaiJ 2 years ago
I doubt that story -- although if Boztepe being some pervert wouldn't surprise me THAT much given his extremely fraudulent, bullshitting nature.
To say that no art or techniques could be inferior is demonstrably false. If I had a style that taught you to fight with your hands behind your head, would you think that me losing had nothing to do with my style?
Boztepe and Cheung looked like fools because their "training" consists of the same shit in this video: patty cake and compliant partners.
kommisar 2 years ago
yes, behind your head, but if you truly study the techniques in WC they DO make sense in every way, the problem is that the average person is working to develop their timing and speed in the ring; something they will never do unless they fight regularly. Master Keith Mazza is 1 person who grew up using WC in the streets of NY & he competed many years ago, so he was one who can use his techniques for the fight. Most schools seem to be geared toward weekend warriors
WingThaiJ 2 years ago
No, no, no. I don't think so. You can't say styles don't matter in one breath and then say, "WC makes sense." Your contention is that if a fighter loses, it's always his own fault, not the style in which he trained. Now you're backpedalling and saying WC makes sense. You can't have it both ways. You can't say, "It's the fighter, not the style," while also saying that WC is effective. I brought up that made-up style to illustrate the point this.
kommisar 2 years ago
Spot on, WingThai. This fucking wannabe-badass fraud knows the minute he steps into the ring his income will take a hit. He won't be able to sell his mystique to credulous ignoramuses as much. (I say as much because most MA con men, no matter how badly they are exposed, always will have loyal, faithful followers.) Money is and isn't the issue. He WOULD fight for money if he could 'cause he's such a camera whore and does his seminar bullshit, but he can't fight so that's that.
kommisar 2 years ago
It seems possible that self defense tech for self protection is different than ring fighting.I can understand being really good @ defending oneself, but this does not nec transfer into a great ring or street fighter.I don't see how Boz can be great, despite his yrs in the art, if he isn't use to fight'g on a reg basis&I don't think he's a bar room brawler.Were I him,I'd let people know that I'm entering a realm I'm not accustomed to&I will gain experience so I learn how to bring WC to the ring.
WingThaiJ 2 years ago
Ring fighting incorporates most of the same things that apply to street fighting and vice versa: proper position, balance, foot work, accurate strikes, etc. They're not worlds and worlds apart as some people claim. I know people who fight in the ring and they don't have much trouble beating the shit out of people in bars.
Besides, if Cheung and Boztepe teach self-defense, then why did neither of them use any of these supposed techniques they teach, in that fight? Think about it.
kommisar 2 years ago
When I speak of self defense, I am referring to the unexpected attack on the street that often occurs by those who are not MMA fighters or the like. Most people who mug people aren't getting into a fighting posture to fight someone, they are the ones lunging in to steal something and the self defense techniques are incorporated. In any even, I agree that people should be able to use the fighting tech in the ring, if you don't, you won't be much of a street fighter.
WingThaiJ 2 years ago
If you get ambushed then you get ambushed. MMA training is definitely applicable to this as much as any other system. It's not like because they didn't have a chance to get their mouthpiece, gloves, cup, 10 minute warm-up, vaseline on their face and notice from a ref to start fighting, that they can't fight off someone ambushing them in the street if the circumstances allow for it.
kommisar 2 years ago
I agree with you, however, there is a difference between self defense & using your fighting skills in the streets. The MT school I went to even related a difference between self defense and fighting. Google Daddis Fight Camps in Philadelphia, Pa.. There are specific tactics to deal w/weapons, etc.. Your fighting skills might be enough, but then again, they might not be.
WingThaiJ 2 years ago
Self-defense is using fighting skills to defend yourself. You're either playing semantics or, at best, splitting hairs. Either way, your point about styles not mattering at all is 100% flawed.
kommisar 2 years ago
I said I agree with you in that if someone teaches you to do something counterproductive. What I am also saying is that if you examined WC techniques, you can see where the techniques are often quite excellent, there just isn't a lot of people use to applying it on a regular basis in a real life setting. MA's in the states is not used like it was used when people did nothing else but MA as their life-style. Also, I believe combining non-conflicting arts is best (JJ w/MT for example)
WingThaiJ 2 years ago
So then you agree style does matter?
There was never a time where people did nothing but MA unless they were either teaching or competing professionally or for a national team. If they did JUST train then how did they earn a living? No one pays you to just train in your dojo or whatever.
No, I don't see any "excellence" in most WC techniques. Their striking is weak, their defense is nonexistent and their training methods are a joke.
kommisar 2 years ago
I can see Y U would say that based on what U visualize on youtube videos. However, I would wager $ that if U met Master Keith Maza, & U just C what he personally does w/ WC, U would change your mind, certainly, don't take my word for it.He was a NY street fighter, he made use of WC , however, he's may be too old now for MMA (my assumption).In early days of the MMA they were promotg BJJ, he has original application, they never let he & his school in.You can discuss this w/him to verify.
WingThaiJ 2 years ago
Unless Keith Maza has credible, verifiable wins on his record or a video of his badass WC skills, I couldn't give two shits about another fabled street fighter story. Boztepe claimed he was a badass street fighter who had no official fight record or even a video to back any of this up but he was proven to be full of shit when put to the test. I'm not going to go out of my way to meet any WC "master" who can actually "fight". Real fighters make their credibility obvious.
kommisar 2 years ago
I agree that people need to put up or shut up. What I was getting @ was for U 2 examine techniques & see how it is used personally, as someone who is really into MMA would be able to C for themselves their potential value. 4 example,some1 tries to strike U w/their right; simple hand tap w/out chasing hands makes sense, however, the other arm is already raised guarding you if the other hand comes in, you can either strike w/that hand or it can defend another strike, & it's already there.
WingThaiJ 2 years ago
My point is that some things you don't need to be proven, they are rather obvious if you examine it yourself. That doesn't mean the person is going to win an MMA fight, as if he doesn't train for this, he'll have little to no possibility of winning.
WingThaiJ 2 years ago
I don't need to try out shitty techniques to know they're shitty. This deluded Boztepe and his fraudulent "grappling" system is total bullshit. Many of the things he does defy basic grappling concepts which have proven effective over many years.
WC doesn't use the kind of blocks you were describing. They fish for the attack with ridiculous "trapping" attempts. Hell, they don't even tuck their chin when they fight.
kommisar 2 years ago
Firstly, I can't comment on Boztepe's techniques, I don't use them. I did WC for a few years, then I did Muay Thai and I just now returned to Muay Thai, but I live in an area where I can only attend MT 1 day per wk & bjj 1 day per week. The WC tech I was describing is via Keith Mazza. What I'm saying is that you can visualize for yourself the techniques & see for yourself it's applicability. You don't need to see an MMA fighter use it to c the obvious benefit to it. Its pretty straight forward.
WingThaiJ 2 years ago
DrT, you're still full of shit even now. When are you gonna grow up? Boztepe has no problem slapping his lackeys around for money. Why would he have a problem accepting money for a real fight?
There's not one thing in this entire video that's banned in MMA. You WC idiots always make that excuse but it's WC that doesn't allow for a lot of MMA techniques. Double leg takedowns and kicks to the head are just a couple of examples.
By the way, you are one ugly motherfucker, hahaha!
kommisar 2 years ago
Why would we injury or kill each other in class? Again, your arguments are not very well thought out.
"There's not one thing in this entire video that's banned in MMA."... except that we no gloves on and no cups, or mouth guards, which are requires in MMA. So again, that is atleast "one thing" that is banned, showing you fail at being an asshole.
DrTzeus 2 years ago
The classic WC paradox: "We know how to do very harmful and even deadly moves in a real fight, but we don't practice them on each other for safety reasons." How the hell do you figure you can do something you never practice? Hitting air isn't the same as hitting a moving target that's trying to hurt you back. Please, Boztepe was already in a real life fight that we've seen, and he looked like a fish out of water. In fact, he didn't even do any of the bullshit he shows off in his videos.
kommisar 2 years ago
A fight from 1984? Please show us a video of YOURSELF from 1984 so we can judge you on that, and ignore the last 25 years of progress.
Kommisar, you border on saying some truth, so I leave you on here, but please get this correct. I do not ever use the "to deadly to spar" BS. I spar, EBMAS spars, so that line won't work.
Sparring is restricted for safety, just like sport MMA is. We are just not interested in changing our rules for training to come over and try out MMA training.
DrTzeus 2 years ago
Oh, please, Boztepe didn't suddenly become a badass over the last 25 years seeing as how that was his last fight. He was already supposedly a WC expert at the time. Where was his WC? We didn't see ANY of it. Two WC masters go at it and neither one of them looks anything like a real fighter. The perfect demonstration for why WC is bullshit.
Haha, Boztepe didn't offer to fight the Gracies. He talked shit and then when he was challenged he found an excuse to back out. The guy is a joke.
kommisar 2 years ago
again, kommi, don't talk about what you don't know.
Boztepe agreed to fight and would bring five fighters, instead Gracies offered him a UFC slot, which required you to pay damages to opponents, no killing, and no eye gouging or bitting. They offered him a "neutral" slot at the police academy where this fight would be a crime, and then the Gracies refused a true neutral spot at a magazine studio. Gracies wanted to control the MONEY from the video of the event and to PROMOTE their UFC show.
DrTzeus 2 years ago
Boztepe would never agree to eye gouging or biting. Did you see the way he "grappled" Cheung? Imagine Royce controlling him with those allowed in place. You're a fucking fool if you think ANYONE in their right mind would turn down a fight because it didn't allow those bitch moves. Boztepe has bragged how his system can beat grapplers and he never shows these "techniques", so obviously his system supposedly can beat a Gracie without bites or eye gouges, you fucking moron.
kommisar 2 years ago
Unless Boz got better since attacking Cheung, there is no way he could grapple with gracies. I have to ask Boz's students if they ever see him actually spar or fight real fights in at least the ring on a regular basis. There's no way he can win without such continual practice.
WingThaiJ 2 years ago
You don't grapple but I will tell you that Boztepe's "anti-grappling" skills that he's shown in other videos is horrible. Even a white belt could get pass Boztepe's stupid little leg maneuvers (pass his guard). He talks about how good this shit is against grapplers, and guess whom he uses to demonstrate this? That's right, one of his students, who has no background in grappling either. Why doesn't he show his shit works ON AN ACTUAL GRAPPLER? Because it wouldn't work. He's a fraud.
kommisar 2 years ago
Unsanctioned fights are a crime no matter where you hold them, so your point about the police academy is completely moot.
Yes, the Gracies wanted to put Boztepe on TV where he'd be humiliated. How telling that Boztepe has no problem filming himself teach his bullshit time and time again, yet refuses to fight on national TV despite bragging about his alleged street fighting background and "anti-grappling" techniques. You'd think he'd be at home in a UFC fight!
kommisar 2 years ago
I think Boz's followers understand, or should understand, that no matter who the person is or how great they are at what they do, they can't enter an unfamiliar environment & expect to do well. He would have to practice for quite some time in the ring 1st, fight many others 1st, get use to the environment & then give it a go while understanding there's no shame in defeat as the best of the best have been defeated & they get back up and fight again.
WingThaiJ 2 years ago
He should have all that practicing out of the way if he were so capable of competing in NHB. The only thing he'd really have to get used to would be the cage, but then again:
1. WC is supposedly tailor-made for close quarter fighting.
2. There weren't many against-the-cage techniques back when Royce was competing in the UFC, like pinning someone against it or using it to get off the ground. Those didn't come till later.
kommisar 2 years ago
Since I experienced WC, I feel it does have extremely useful technqs, but such techniques don't mean anyth'g if your'e not use to the 'fight.' As I said before, schools promoting MMA invariable include bjj&MT.WC schools don't advertise as MMA. People who want to fight naturally go to what they see as MMA. Many who are just there for self defense & a hobby r more likely to go into WC unfortunately. In any art, U need the ones who want to fight, in order to get 'fighter types' for the MMA.
WingThaiJ 2 years ago
I think the MMA schools attract real fighters, even if WC can be used for real fighters.
WingThaiJ 2 years ago
Actually, a lot of people do MMA for hobby, fitness and self-defense and have no aspirations to compete.
"Being used to 'the fight'" is nothing more than being used to fighting a fully resisting opponent, which is exactly what is done in MMA and what you almost never see in WC, and certainly never see with Boztepe.
kommisar 2 years ago
NO, he agreed but all proceeds after training expenses had to go to a charity, Gracies refuse as they wanted the PROFIT for their pocket.
A magazine publisher offered their studio, true no rules event, and Gracies refused. I give them the benefit of the doubt that they wanted the money from the video, but maybe they where scared to lose an eye while trying to choke him out.
UFC rules prevent anti-grap due to the restrictions around kicking downed opponents and striking the neck with elbows.
DrTzeus 2 years ago
It seems all of Boztepe's reasons for refusing the fight are fucking pathetic: it wouldn't be a charity fight, it would happen on TV, he wouldn't be allowed to use techniques which he doesn't even train, etc.
Yes, the Gracies were invested in the UFC. It cost THEM money to put on the fight, dumbass. Haha, this is hilarious. You're actually criticizing the Gracies for not giving their money away. You're an idiot. You look like one too in the video.
kommisar 2 years ago
Are you fucking kidding me? OK, now it's 100% clear you're lying just to defend your pussy teacher. UFC rules at the time were vale tudo rules: no eye gouges, no biting and no groin strikes, and the last one was repealed after the first or second event. The rules about kicking the heads of a downed opponent and all that didn't come till much later after the Gracies left the UFC.
Besides, you once again IGNORE the point that BOZTEPE DOESN'T DO ANY OF THOSE THINGS (EYE GOUGES, ETC.)!